Trying to improve

[Trowa]

Hi I'm trying to improve my work and any advice/tips would be appreciated.

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3261/...573f707d_b.jpg

This next one is still a work in progress.

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3320/...989b4b8f_b.jpg

[tiff]

hey how do you retouch your photo's?

[igot2pman]

Trowa,

You have done a really clean job on the face. Improvements could be to better master body D&B.

The second one, looks good but could be polished off a bit more. Her jacket is dirty on the lapel. A hair sticking out of her right arm and some specks on the umbrella.

Overall I really like what you have done, its easy going on my eyes. The blue in the second one, is that an overlay or a white balance shift?

Good job,
-Keven

[TommyO]

Trowa,
On the first one, I prefer a small bit more light revealed under the hat. You may also want to work separately on the clothing and reveal more color/sat on those subtle tones.

I agree with Kevin on the second. The overall increase in blue leaves a peculiar tone to the image. It just doesn't seem natural. If that's the intent, it's fine.

[Trowa]

Originally Posted by tiff

hey how do you retouch your photo's?

I'm not sure if you would like to know the program I use or the technique but I will try to answer both. I use Photoshop CS3 and I use its Camera Raw for some of the color correcting,white balance,etc. As for the retouching I mostly use the healing brush and than dodge and burn using an overlay layer filled with a neutral gray. Occasionally I use some adjustment layers here and there.

[Trowa]

Originally Posted by igot2pman

Trowa,

You have done a really clean job on the face. Improvements could be to better master body D&B.

The second one, looks good but could be polished off a bit more. Her jacket is dirty on the lapel. A hair sticking out of her right arm and some specks on the umbrella.

Overall I really like what you have done, its easy going on my eyes. The blue in the second one, is that an overlay or a white balance shift?

Good job,
-Keven

Thanks Keven, I was so preoccupied with the face on both pics that I completly neglected the body. As for the blue tint on the second one it was a shift in the white balance I intentionally made in camera raw. The original image just was too overblown for my taste and the look my friends photographer said she was going for, I wanted to move it more towards one of those bright overcast days that we have in California rather than really try to explain how that works I'll leave it at that. Really if I remember right it was a very hot day and the jacket and the umbrella were very out of place, except maybe for keeping the sun off of you.

Originally Posted by TommyO

Trowa,
On the first one, I prefer a small bit more light revealed under the hat. You may also want to work separately on the clothing and reveal more color/sat on those subtle tones.

I agree with Kevin on the second. The overall increase in blue leaves a peculiar tone to the image. It just doesn't seem natural. If that's the intent, it's fine.

Hi, TommyO
I didn't notice how dark it had gotten underneath the hat until I put the original and the retouch onto one pic, I hoped nobody would notice but you're right its something I should address, thank you.

Although I was going for that kind of blue tone, the blue around the trees has always bothered me a little, I think if anything I will have to find some way to minimize that effect. Unfortunately its from the recovery and white balance in camera raw so it may be more complicated than just masking out parts on an adjustment layer. I suppose I could put a copy of the original underneath and use a reduced opacity brush around that kind of blue outline the tone is casting around the trees.

[w23]

There is not enough of an improvement for me to care. Push, push, push. They are both bland images. Make me want to look at them.

[Trowa]

This should make it easier to see since the reduced image size on flickr cut out most of the details:

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3396/...1e2608da_b.jpg

I added the little attachment just as a preview

[Trowa]

Originally Posted by w23

There is not enough of an improvement for me to care. Push, push, push. They are both bland images. Make me want to look at them.

Yeah I appreciate that you took the time to comment but "Push, push push." doesn't mean much of anything in terms of steps towards improving the retouch. You might want to read through the "Guidelines - Required Reading before posting!" section though. http://www.retouchpro.com/forums/cri...e-posting.html
If I was looking for a simple "I like or I don't like" kind of response I would not have posted here. I'm looking for feedback I can use to make actual steps forward. If you had said, "do such and such on the D & B layer or try this adjustment layer" or something that was an actual directive it would have been helpful but if I want to know if people in general like it I've no problem nor a shortage of random people to ask.

[igot2pman]

Trowa,

The blow up reviles a lot more to the face. And depending on the format your going to be using this picture in, you may want to keep doing a bit more evening on the face. Like if the picture is going to be blown up I would do a bit more. Specifically the parts in red below. There may be more but those pop out to me. If this is going to be an 8-10, I don’t think they would show.

D&B is a pain. Every time you zoom out, you see the next uneven part. It seems like a never ending process, but in the end its worth it.

Just being nitt picky,
-Keven

[Trowa]

Originally Posted by igot2pman

Trowa,

The blow up reviles a lot more to the face. And depending on the format your going to be using this picture in, you may want to keep doing a bit more evening on the face. Like if the picture is going to be blown up I would do a bit more. Specifically the parts in red below. There may be more but those pop out to me. If this is going to be an 8-10, I don’t think they would show.

D&B is a pain. Every time you zoom out, you see the next uneven part. It seems like a never ending process, but in the end its worth it.

Just being nitt picky,
-Keven

Thanks for the feedback I'll definitely work on those spots, I just want it to be as good as I can get it. Most likely it will be in multiple formats and I don't want the digital copy to reveal any flaws the print out masks. Thanks again for highlighting those spots.

[igot2pman]

I just learned this technique to more easily see uneven skin problems. I learned it from the video talked about HERE

Two black filled layers in a folder
One set to color blending mode
The other set to overlay (more powerful) or soft light blending mode

(turn the folder on and off to show hide)

-Keven

[Trowa]

Originally Posted by igot2pman

I just learned this technique to more easily see uneven skin problems. I learned it from the video talked about HERE

Two black filled layers in a folder
One set to color blending mode
The other set to overlay (more powerful) or soft light blending mode

(turn the folder on and off to show hide)

-Keven

I'm downloading the video now, thanks again.

[TommyO]

Trowa,
You have made very good improvements and the larger image allows us to evaluate them much better. You mentioned that "I just want it to be as good as I can get it". I am concerned that with the original image size and scale, the skin may be good enough. There is always that trade off between image size, what you're getting paid to do, and the eventual loss of a natural look. An image cropped as shown above (with a lot of background) may not need so much attention to the face/skin. More attention to lighting, background, distractions, depth of field, etc may also be needed.

Just a thought, and of course we do not know how you plan to eventually crop the image. If you plan to turn it into more of a head shot, then certainly keep working on the skin. But, without that, examine more of the image as well.

[biskit27]

first picture- I don't know if it's just me, but I would love to see maybe a darker feel to the whole picture, perhaps something lomo-esque or something with more intense contrasts, the entire image feels too 'bright' to me. Also I agree with an earlier reply that suggests you work a bit more on the subtle tone differences in the jacket and hat, both seem a bit flat.

second- Don't know what exactly you're trying to achieve with the feel of it, personally I might try to lower the saturation of the background a bit and maybe try bumping up the individual colors in her shirt. Also the shadows on the right eye and temple seem to me to be a little too dark, maybe see if lightening that a little bit might look better? Also another tiny thing I saw was she has a few small creases on her neck that I would try removing or lightening a bit with just a simple dodge.

A reply earlier said 'Push, push, push.' While they didn't give any specific recommendation as to what to do, I don't disagree with the comment, both images seem like they might be VERY interesting with some more work, but both do seem to have come straight from raw. Both images are great bases to work off of to create a piece of very intense art, I just don't know if you've really discovered where you want to go with either just yet.

Anyways, just a few random things I noticed

[jbedford]

I like your direction. You have a good eye for color and balance imho.

[Trowa]

Originally Posted by jbedford

I like your direction. You have a good eye for color and balance imho.

Thank you.

[Trowa]

Originally Posted by TommyO

Trowa,
You have made very good improvements and the larger image allows us to evaluate them much better. You mentioned that "I just want it to be as good as I can get it". I am concerned that with the original image size and scale, the skin may be good enough. There is always that trade off between image size, what you're getting paid to do, and the eventual loss of a natural look. An image cropped as shown above (with a lot of background) may not need so much attention to the face/skin. More attention to lighting, background, distractions, depth of field, etc may also be needed.

Just a thought, and of course we do not know how you plan to eventually crop the image. If you plan to turn it into more of a head shot, then certainly keep working on the skin. But, without that, examine more of the image as well.

Thanks for the insight, I think on both of these photos I got kind of fixated on working the face and forgot about the rest so I will make a better effort on the rest of the photo as well.