Any hope for this Moiré?

[PixelHawk]

Hello,

This is part of a client supplied image for an ad running in one of the publications I do image retouching for. As you can see there are horrible moirés in the fabric pattern on the sofa.

I've tried just about every technique I could find in the books I have, searching this forum, and looking for other online tutorials. It has my supervisor and I both stumped!

Is there any hope for it? Help?

A smaller version of the file is attached, but if you want to see the full size image, you can get it here: full size image

Thank you!

[Mike]

When I look at this the pattern changes as you change the image size (on both the images you posted). I have also seen this happen on some of my own stuff.

If I go to print one of these type images, usually the pattern does not show up in the print.

So I guess what is happening is that the pattern appears on your screen when the resolution and size of the image match up with the dot pattern of the monitor, when you have the right pattern in the image to begin with.

Not really sure that that theory holds any water, but am always open to any other suggestions.

[PixelHawk]

I was hoping for that too... but not only did we run a print in-house on our 7800, we sent it out to run on Kodak approval... its still there.

The really bad thing about this particular image, is it seems that no matter what you try to do to it, it gets worse.

[MisterJP]

See if you like this.

I found a section of fabric that didn't have a moiré, then created a pattern out of it. Created a full layer of the pattern and put the couch picture over it, erasing away only what was needed to reveal the pattern below, being careful to keep any areas of detail/edging. Then used dodge/burn to add back in the correct shading to make it look more realistic.

[Jerryb]

Hello,
First I think for this kind of moire pattern Misterjp technique I think is the best route to go and his retouch was extremely good....

Now the following procedure not sure if you have seen....... but I can see it working for certain kinds of moire pattern... which you can maybe put in your ref list... it specifically for photoshop in mind....
http://members.fortunecity.com/dleon...tips/moire.htm

Originally Posted by PixelHawk

Hello,

This is part of a client supplied image for an ad running in one of the publications I do image retouching for. As you can see there are horrible moirés in the fabric pattern on the sofa.

I've tried just about every technique I could find in the books I have, searching this forum, and looking for other online tutorials. It has my supervisor and I both stumped!

Is there any hope for it? Help?

A smaller version of the file is attached, but if you want to see the full size image, you can get it here: full size image

Thank you!

[Daviskw]

Very good job MisterJP... just wondering have you tried scanning at an angle... say 45 degrees.

Or two scans at different angles then recombining.

Butch

[BillFrey]

I added some grain to break up the moire.

Photo#1 = before
Photo#2 = after

Edit: Tried to get a little better result..
#3 = Hi Pass Filter .1 radius, 2 times,
Ran the median filter on background layer.

[Flora]

Hi PixelHawk,

if I haven't done it yet, welcome to RP!!

Don't know if it will be good enough for print, but, working on your full size image I followed (and tweaked) this great procedure... (thanks again for it, Rô!!! )

Originally Posted by Mike

When I look at this the pattern changes as you change the image size (on both the images you posted). I have also seen this happen on some of my own stuff.

... so true ... that's why my attachments are at 100% (which I think is the most important..) and 200% size ... if you view the image at smaller magnifications you'll still see the 'pattern' ...

Let me know if it's ok and if you'd like the exact 'tweaks' I used on your picture.

[Cassidy]

Wow excellent Flora, care to share a little more info?

[PixelHawk]

Wow! Some fabulous responses from all of you! Thank you! I can see that once again, there are multiple ways of achieving the same goal in Photoshop, and I plan on using each of these when the need arises.

Flora, thank you for the welcome... this is a fantastic forum! And yes, if you would be so kind... I'd really appreciate the tweaks you used on the image.

Funny how just as you start to think you're getting pretty good at something, you get humbled by a thing as simple as this.

[PixelHawk]

Originally Posted by Jerryb

Now the following procedure not sure if you have seen....... but I can see it working for certain kinds of moire pattern... which you can maybe put in your ref list... it specifically for photoshop in mind....
http://members.fortunecity.com/dleon...tips/moire.htm

Hey, thanks for posting the link to that technique! I just had to utilize it for a scan, and it worked a lot better than the method I usually use.

[Jerryb]

hi keri,
thank you and your welcome..... I am glad to be able to contribute... I am real new to the boards...... and I am a cream puff compared to you and the other people how knowledable you are in using PS and the expertise you have... I just hope and can get at least a 1/3 as good as all of you are and contribut more...

Originally Posted by PixelHawk

Wow! Some fabulous responses from all of you! Thank you! I can see that once again, there are multiple ways of achieving the same goal in Photoshop, and I plan on using each of these when the need arises.

Flora, thank you for the welcome... this is a fantastic forum! And yes, if you would be so kind... I'd really appreciate the tweaks you used on the image.

Funny how just as you start to think you're getting pretty good at something, you get humbled by a thing as simple as this.

[Daviskw]

Hi there

Here I thought I was going to have the answer... degrunge.... only to finally read the posts and see Flora had used it.... well I already had this to go so i will post it. I managed to get the picture much smaller without moiré...

Funny if I view this picture in XP file manager the moiré does not show on my computer at any resolution... but in Photoshop it does... go figure.

Butch

[pepperspray]

I can't believe how you guys have worked that image!


Edit: Ok, never mind about the what causes it question, I found the answer right here at RetouchPro!

[Gary Richardson]

Been playing with Ro's technique (thanks Fora for reminding me of it), and struggling mightily.

Then as Doug reminds us, I got a A-Ha moment and switched to view at 100%, and the technique which hadn't upto that point seemed to work, worked as it should.

Below is my attempt, nowhere near as good as some of the others, but for a first attempt with a new technique I'm reasonably happy (now to go away and practice with it).

For any Numptys like me who had trouble with this, this is my step by step guide. (I've just re-written Ro's excellent work slightly, by adding a little on how I got the radii for HP and GB).

• Set View to Actual pixels (100%).
• Copy image to new layer.

All the following are applied to the new layer.

• Desaturate layer (or you get color bleed in your final image).
• Apply High Pass filter, and adjust radius till you get MAX moire showing.
• Invert.
• Set layer blend to Linear Light, and set layer opacity to 50%.
• Apply Gaussian Blur, and adjust radius till Moire isn't seen and checks in sofa are.
• Apply layer mask and mask out all areas that didn't have Moire to begin with.

[lkroll]

...Ro's a genius. Thanks Flora for the link. I've seen other posts that struggle with this and this one definitely beats out the lab color technique.

[PixelHawk]

Ro's technique definitely got it to look a TON better than it did! After several different attempts, I went with the way that Gary outlined. Here's the final result. Not 'perfect'... but a vast improvement. Just hope it still looks good when it prints.

Thanks again for everybody's help!

[Flora]

Hi,

... so glad I could help with the link!!

Originally Posted by lkroll

...Ro's a genius.

... So true!!!

Might be late already, but here is how I used and adapted Rô's technique for this image....

Following Rô's instructions exactly:

• Duplicated the Background.
• Run Filter>Other High Pass on the duplicate.
• Changed the High Pass Layer's Blending to Linear Light
• Run Gaussian Blur on the Linear Light Layer...

.... here are the exact values I used for the 'full size' image:

• High Pass Filter = (Attachment 1)
• Gaussian Blur = (Attachment 2)
• Left the Linear Light Layer's Opacity at 100%..

My Mask = (Attachment 3)

Hope this still helps...

[Gary Richardson]

...Ro's a genius.

Not gonna get any arguments from me.

Thanks Flora for sharing, interesting that your settings are significantly different to the ones I used, 8 for HP and 2 for GB if I remember correctly, (I'll have to try out varying Linear Light opacity and see how it effects things).

[mistermonday]

I found that HP=6 and GB = 1 worked very well for me with the Opacity at 50%. Clearly the process has a fair amount of lattitude. I also found that a small amount of unsharp mask or smart sharpen really made the final image pop and seemed to completely mitigate the softening caused by the HP-GB process ... and of course the moire pattern had disappeared.
Regards, Murray

[PixelHawk]

I think ultimately my settings might have been a little higher than that (darn, now I wish I had written them down!), but they seemed to work out. Ended up adding just a tiny bit of noise to it as well... I had considered doing a little sharpening but I was afraid it would just put the moire back in. Ran the proof on the Epson and it seemed to be ok... I guess I'll know when the magazine is pirinted.

[Gary Richardson]

Good luck Keri, let us know how it all turns out.

[PixelHawk]

Thank you. The magazine shipped to the printer today... so I'll know in a week or so. The ad client was happy to know we found a solution, and wants to know how we did it... I'm pointing her to this site.

[Flora]

... four of us used Rô's technique... we all used different values and it worked well for all!!!

That's what counts....Good luck, Keri!!

[PixelHawk]

Hey All!

Just wanted to let you know I saw the printed piece containing that pic this morning. The Moire is not there!!!

So THANK YOU again for the help on this image.

[Gary Richardson]

Glad things turned out well. Thanks for letting us know.

[byRo]

Glad to see that everybody was having fun while I was away.
Can't see myself as a genius, though - it's just you folks who are too nice!

Originally Posted by PixelHawk

Just wanted to let you know I saw the printed piece containing that pic this morning. The Moire is not there!!!

Now, that's good news.

Seeing that this topic has come up before, and the technique also solved the other problem - seems that this is destined to become tutorial material.

However, then I would need an example image.
Would it be possible to use the image posted in this thread?
As this image is "client supplied" that would mean an OK not just from the client but from the photograper too. (We can forget the model's release this time )

OR

If anybody has an unrestricted image with moiré problems I would be glad to hear from you. Please?

Rô (part-time genius )

[creeduk]

Excellent thread and Ro brilliant method. Flora as usual you manipulate the tools beautifully and get awesome results.
That was a fun one I tried various other techniques but non of them came close, I guess due to the fact it is not a standard screen causes moiré but a fabric visual one. Great work all.

[ianh_1998]

I added one small modification to the workflow already described; I modified the levels (moved the black point and white point to the beginning of the histogram) associated with the rusltant HP/GB/invert/overlay layer. This added more contrast to the filter and by moving the greay point(mid point) in Levels, I had the chance to vary the amount or moire removed.
Regards
Ian

[jarthel]

Originally Posted by Gary Richardson

• Set View to Actual pixels (100%).
• Copy image to new layer.

All the following are applied to the new layer.

• Desaturate layer (or you get color bleed in your final image).
• Apply High Pass filter, and adjust radius till you get MAX moire showing.
• Invert.
• Set layer blend to Linear Light, and set layer opacity to 50%.
• Apply Gaussian Blur, and adjust radius till Moire isn't seen and checks in sofa are.
• Apply layer mask and mask out all areas that didn't have Moire to begin with.

hope the mods doesn't mind me reviving an old thread

2 questions if you can please help

1. how do I desaturate? I am using cs4 and I cannot see any option in the layer menu.

2. how do I implement the last instruction? (i.e. apply layer mask...)

please see attached image.

Thank you very much