Saving Photos from poor lighting,...

[NiteOwl]

I like your style and your attitude! Wow....someone else who can see what I was going for...thanks so much for your input to this photo....it really means a lot to me,...seriously!

Ex photographer, ? why? I thought those who shot always shot forever and ever amen....just curious.

Thanks for your time to respond, it is well appreciated...

Take care,
Nite Owl

[Mike]

NiteOwl
I am sorry about the comment about the black eye, I did not catch the background on her life. I too have some customers that have a life with those kind of problems, makes for some tough times and bad thoughts about the skills of some parents.
I like the photo of the two girls a lot better. Altho when I first looked at it I got the feeling they had just been caught doing something they were not supposed to be doing! Did you do a series of these and have them change their expressions? Sometimes catching them with a kind of coy little smile (the "look at us, we are cute, don't you wish you were?") or whatever, but not the great big grining smile.
I find that trying to critique someones work on this kind of forum is really hard. I am more of a visual person than a word person so it is hard to really type what I mean. And its not easy for someone to realise the comments are meant for the work, not the person, so I tend to not make too many comments. So I would advise that you listen to all of us, not take it to heart but apply the comments to your work. Then when you are out shooting you can maybe try some of the ideas you have been given if you like.
When I teach photography I always tell my students that the measure of good or bad is the authors opinion. If you like it, it is good. You only have to satisfy yourself, the rest of the world can just go take a leap!!!!
Keep up the good work
Mike

[NiteOwl]

I wasnt at all upset by your critique or your impressions. Actually quite happy all the way around.

Catch ya later,
Nite Owl

[roger_ele]

NiteOwl

To learn lighting - when you are taking photos, or just looking - concentrate on the shadows, we are so used to looking at the light areas that we take our shadows for granted - they are far too special to be taken so lightly

While concetrating on the shadows pay attention to all of the following (and anything else you can think of);
-The shapes and compositional elements the shadows create.
-How dark they are compared to the light areas (Our eyes aren't good at judging brightness but are amazing when making comparisons).
-Why the shadow is there, In the case of your photo light is coming from her ear side and the back and nothing is bright enough or reflecting enough light in that one little area between the eye and the nose. In the case of a person leaning against a tree in the shade the shadow side of the face will be the tree side because it is blocking the reflected light from that side, etc.

And then notice why the highlight is there ... the next time you see a tree in the shade next to a piece of sidewalk thet has sunlight on it notice the glow on the tree from the reflected sunlight...

You are drawn to this emotionally so it makes it hard to be aware of these things when involved in photographing someone you care about - but the better you get at being fully aware the better you will get at finding ways to interprete your subject.

Give yourself permission to step back and just expierience why it looks the way it does, then guess/visualize how you think the scene would look (lighting and composition wise) from different angles without moving to those spots (the side, the back, below, above) then go look and see how close you came and get involved with your subject for a while, then step back and do it again ... I know this sounds difficult and a little esoteric, but no matter where you are at doing this stuff (or attempting to do this stuff) doing these exercises will improve your percentage of successes dramatically.

Have fun, Roger

[NiteOwl]

Roger,

First I want to thank you for taking the time to type out your advice and information,...that was super.

Secondly, thank you for giving me a new way to look a lighting. I sometimes have a problem with concept...in 9th grade it was Algebra, in networking it was TCP/IP and binary conversions, in photography it is lighting. I can see, read and understand, but unfortunately until the little light bulb in my brain goes off, I really can't grasp it. I am one of those who must understand something inside and out, and know not only why it works but the nuts and bolts to how it works.

I am glad to see this new twist on looking at my lighting issues. I do truly want to learn and excell. I can look at a photo and tell you pretty much what is wrong with it and why based on lighting issues,...but taking them...a whole nother story!

I have printed your message, I hope that is okay. I wish to go over it and really apply it to my photography. Again, thank you for your information, knowledge and time to send this.

Take care,
Nite Owl

[roger_ele]

You are very welcome! Print away - play away ... light is something I am passionate about and I love to share it ... so it is a real thrill for me when I can, Roger

[NiteOwl]

If anything at all I am a willing student! I was just quoted as being one "stubborn strong willed woman", imagine that! As I said I can see it, I just can't yet reproduce it,...however, you will not be dissappointed. In the future your advice and that of others will pay off, mark my words,...the lightbulb will come on, sooner or later, and then....BINGO...I will get it.

You are a great guy, and have great advice and insight,...thanks again,..

Catch you soon,
NiteOwl

[pstewart]

Originally posted by NiteOwl
I like your style and your attitude! Wow....someone else who can see what I was going for...thanks so much for your input to this photo....it really means a lot to me,...seriously!

Ex photographer, ? why? I thought those who shot always shot forever and ever amen....just curious.

Well, "ex" as in no longer doing weddings and reunions "professionally"...translated "for money." When the video camera became popular years ago, wedding albums became less important to folks, and I had grown pretty tired of it anyway. I still love to take photos, of course, but right now my dear old (first year edition) Maxxum is not working properly...thanks for reminding me to take it in for cleaning/repair. My goal is to get something like the Nikon 5700 digital so I can do away with film and processing forever...wheeee. But I'm waiting for better resolution, bigger disks to hold more pics, and a lower price. Should be about two years I'm guessing.

Phyllis

[NiteOwl]

I got my camera after using a Sony Mavica 2.0 for a year for work. Dissappointing when trying to print anything. The camera I purchased is a Sony Cyber shot 3.3 mgpixel....it does okay for an 8 x 10 print if necessary,...but gosh, I am already dreaming of the Nikon, same camera as you want actually! That is my dream baby!

I have always had an artistic side to me, and loved charcoals, sketching, drawing, did some oil painting, and water colors,...computers really got me geeked. But eventually I managed to make my goals and climb the ladder only to find it a bit boring...

With photography I am in 7th heaven. Not only can I take pictures and create my own art,...but I can then play with them on the PC and do even more! I love it! I did a pretty mean sketch and charcoal years ago, and if I can apply that type of skill to photos...whoa!!!!

I have heard that 'weddings' are a pain and a lot of work...and I am finding that portraits are a bit 'limited' for me...lighting, and standards, and expectations,...maybe more than I wish to deal with...we will see.

Thank you for filling me in...I think I will be taking pictures for years to come....I did point and shoot and got into 'crapping' for a while, but became bored with the limitations...and the major cost of film and developing, and was also unsatisfied with the photos from a simple camera.

Lets hope this one is the right thing for me....I think so, I love the versitility and options and my word,...one can go crazy with the software...

Thanks for responding,...look forward to hearing again and seeing your work...
Nite Owl

[roger_ele]

A couple of additional tricks that will help you to see the light;

Make your hand into a soft fist and look at your subject through the tunnel your hand creates. This way, your pupils are not shutting down due to brighter lights and you will really see the light that is there. Do this at something that is in deep shadow to really enjoy it.

Go into a dark room with a flashlight, a piece of kleenex and a small object like a light bulb. Set the light bulb down, shine the flashlight on it, hold up the kleenex between the flashlight and the lightbulb, notice that you have a reflection of the light source in the center, call it the highlight, then you have the secondary light that falls outside the highlight, it gets darker as it wraps around the bulb. Vary all the distances, flashlight to kleenex, kleenex to bulb, flashlight and kleenex to bulb and watch:
-The size of the highlight changes, notice how the shape of the highlight is the same as the shape of the light source.
-The contrast between the highlight and the secondary light changes.
-The amount the secondary light wraps around the bulb changes.

Take a person outside to the shadow side of a tree with heavy foliage on a sunny day. Stand them facing away from the tree at the edge of the overhang of branches. Watch the dark circles under their eyes appear and dissappear as you have the person take a step backwards and forwards. It is the light that the subject sees from their point of view that determines the lighting.

This should plant the seeds! Have fun, Roger

[NiteOwl]

Roger, thanks for the lesson on lighting! Wow, no one has said anything at like this to me or bothered to put it into a truly physical way. I am already hunting for a flashlight!

I have printed your words of wisdom so that I can ponder over them in more depths, I hope that is okay.

Again, thank you so much. I think I am beginning to see this in a very different way, although a way which will only improve my work.

Catch ya later,
Nite Owl