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Monitor profiling problem & other questions

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  #1  
Old 06-10-2014, 08:53 PM
frankg frankg is offline
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Monitor profiling problem & other questions

Posted on Luminous Landscape as well not being sure where I'm likely to get a good explanation.

Mac OS X 10.6.8
Mac intel tower with nvidia 7300gt graphics card
Dell Ultrasharp display 2007FP (dvi connection = no contrast control)
i1 Display 2 & Eye-One match3 v3.6.3

I use EyeOne i1 Display2 to target values of Gamma 2.2, White Point (Col Temp) 6500K, Luminance 110 cd/m2.
I adjusted my monitor controls (Brightness and individual RGB) to max Brightness and set the individual RGB controls to 100%.
I achieve the Gamma and WP but only get to less than half the Brightness target and cant find a way to increase the Brightness/Luminance.
There is no Brightness slider in the System Prefs>Display as I think the OS defers to the 3rd party monitors controls.

Perhaps not being able to get even close to the Luminance target means that my monitor has to be replaced? But first I want to make sure I am doing everything I can to fix the situation.
And if the monitor is done, I need to find the least expensive monitor that'll do the pro calibration job and am looking at the Viewsonic VP2365-LED 23 inch.

If I am printing on my Epson with paper profiles then I can make adjustments to the target values to get the right screen to print match (I understand that the light under which to evaluate prints should be around D50 (5000K). And I understand that the ideal luminance level is also dependent on ambient conditions.
Here's what I don't get - more often it is a case of submitting a file to either a pro lab (for c-prints) or to a client who will reproduce the image in an ad or brochure or magazine or whatever.
With Gamma, WP & Luminance settings being flexible and slightly different for everyone, how do I know what targets to use to ensure that they/you will see the same image as i am seeing on my screen.
And of course the other is website images - how do I know you are seeing (on your differently calibrated monitor) the same image I'm seeing. For example, if I photoshop an image and it looks good to me on my screen which is set to Gamma 2.2, WP 6500 but a current Luminance (which i cant seem to adjust...see above) of say 50 cd/m2 then what are you likely to be seeing....
Thanks,
Frank
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Old 06-11-2014, 05:11 AM
klev klev is offline
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Re: Monitor profiling problem & other questions

There are a couple things to note. One is that I wouldn't ever touch the contrast control on an lcd display. Assuming a small print viewer, you're unlikely to need 110 cd/m^2 to match perceptual print brightness. If it's only reading half of that, that would be 55 cd/m^2, which would appear very dim and lacking in contrast on most displays. Most displays do not hold a good contrast ratio at lower brightness levels. You don't need D50 lighting, and it won't match your display. Some of the really expensive displays can get close, and may be used in proofing environments. With what you're describing trying to achieve that would be a step backwards in terms of getting a match. Ideally I would start out at "native" setting with color temp, although it shouldn't measure far off D65. These things aren't perfect, so I usually go with native and adjust from there. If you were correlating a number of displays, that would be different.

Anyway does the display appear really dim? If the reading is accurate, it will not seem bright by any standard. I'm just skeptical because most displays would require an immense number of hours to get to that point. Most start over 200 cd/m^2 at max brightness, so you would be beyond the second cycle of the half life of the backlight.
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Old 06-11-2014, 09:15 AM
frankg frankg is offline
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Re: Monitor profiling problem & other questions

Native WP only reaches 4800
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Old 06-11-2014, 09:42 AM
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andrewrodney andrewrodney is offline
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Re: Monitor profiling problem & other questions

Quote:
Originally Posted by frankg View Post
Posted on Luminous Landscape as well not being sure where I'm likely to get a good explanation.
http://www.luminous-landscape.com/tu...too_dark.shtml

50cd/m2 isn't going to fly, raise the print viewing conditions next to the display.
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Old 06-11-2014, 03:09 PM
frankg frankg is offline
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Re: Monitor profiling problem & other questions

I am going to get a replacement -
these 3 are within about 4 dollars of each other -
Dell U2412M, Viewsonic VP2365, NEC EA223WM
Please advise
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Old 06-11-2014, 04:54 PM
klev klev is offline
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Re: Monitor profiling problem & other questions

Quote:
Originally Posted by andrewrodney View Post
http://www.luminous-landscape.com/tu...too_dark.shtml

50cd/m2 isn't going to fly, raise the print viewing conditions next to the display.
I'm still skeptical as to whether that was an accurate reading. I have one display that I've used since 2006. It has long since been retired to a secondary display, and it has well over 10,000 hours according to its counter. Even that still gives a greater maximum brightness than 50cd/m^2.

Quote:
Originally Posted by frankg View Post
Native WP only reaches 4800
If that reading is accurate, your display is definitely dying. CCFL can yellow a bit over time, but I've never seen it get to that degree. Displays typically have a certain amount of warmup time. Prior to calibration you should allow it at least 30 minutes. For a display with a high number of hours of total running time, I would give it closer to an hour. When it won't be in use for more than a couple hours, you should always turn it off. These things degrade with use, and it's often worse toward the lower end displays like the ones you are using and considering. I wouldn't leave them on constantly.

Quote:
Originally Posted by frankg View Post
I am going to get a replacement -
these 3 are within about 4 dollars of each other -
Dell U2412M, Viewsonic VP2365, NEC EA223WM
Please advise
I don't have anything great to say about Viewsonic. The Dell is a 6 bit IPS. Looking back at the original post, do not regard gamma as flexible. Tweaking the matrix values in that area is a bad idea, and you are in no way exercising any kind of low level hardware control. Anyway NEC has decent warranties. My experiences with them have been a little hit and miss, but without detailed reviews I would probably go with that one. The only way you'll find better advice is by digging up detailed reviews on each. It's unlikely that anyone on here has experience with all 3.
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Old 06-11-2014, 06:01 PM
frankg frankg is offline
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Re: Monitor profiling problem & other questions

Unfortunately they're all 6 bit
I wish i had the $ for a higher end model but alas...
The online reviews dont really clarify which one to get - I'm leaning to the dell
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Old 06-12-2014, 09:25 AM
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andrewrodney andrewrodney is offline
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Re: Monitor profiling problem & other questions

Try to raise the budget, there's little more important to the digital darkroom than the display.
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