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Deep Paint 2.0 Tutorial

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  #11  
Old 02-08-2006, 02:42 PM
Ken45140 Ken45140 is offline
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Deep Paint vs Painter Essentials2

Today I created my first Deep Paint(ing) using my newly acquired Intuos3 tablet. Amazing difference painting with the tablet/pen vs the mouse. Much easier, quicker, and the pressure seemed to contribute to the result (even thou I have not played around with pressure settings in DP).

Along with the tablet came a copy of Painter Essentials2, and I used it to create PhotoArt from the same image. I've attached both results below for side by side comparison for those interested. (CM3.jpg produced in DeepPaint)

While I have not spent a lot of time with PainterE, it has been enough to know that Deep Paint has orders of magnitude more adjustments, flexibilities and features. I suspect I will continue to try both but emphasize building up experience with Deep Paint. Perhaps it will become clear what strengths PainterE has for certain images/situations vs DP.

Ken
Attached Images
File Type: jpg Clone of flowervase1.jpg (74.8 KB, 99 views)
File Type: jpg CM3.jpg (48.2 KB, 117 views)
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  #12  
Old 02-08-2006, 03:03 PM
stuart stuart is offline
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Re: Deep Paint 2

Ken,
Thanks for the pics and the answer to my question about DP not "filling" all the brush strokes.
1. First of all, which of the pics above is DP (the one on the left or the one on the right side of the monitior as you look at it) ?
2. What is your brush technique to get this type if result ? If I do a careful clone it looks like a dup of the original pic and if I' m not careful it looks like a maze of brushstrokes.

3. Using Fine Detail with the mouse seems to fill in all the paint stroke. However, with my new Wacom Intuos, there is lack of fill (many uncovered spots) unless I really press on the pen or tilt it in unusual ways. I am using the default settings on the Wacom. Any ideas ?
I also have Painter 9 but Deep Paint 2 seems to give watercolor effects a lot easier, so I will stick with trying to make it work

Stuart
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  #13  
Old 02-08-2006, 03:43 PM
Ken45140 Ken45140 is offline
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Stuart: Thanks for replying. If you hover your mouse over the righthand thumbnail, you will see it say "CM3", that is the Deep Paint version. The other one has text on it which says "Painter Essentials", although it is hard to read.

As far as your comment about me answering about DP "filling" the brush strokes...not sure where I did that, but it is a reality. What that means is that when I take the first basic ClonerEx brush, top of the list on Cloner Ex list (which I start with most of the time), and work it back and forth, there is a random orientation of the oval. Sometimes it is vertical, then horizontal, then on an angle. I am not sure which of the detailed brush settings controls that, but nonetheless, it happens. If you go back and forth (low pressure), you should get a lot of overlapping ovals. Eventually things get covered, but there are inevitable white (uncovered) spots between the overlapping ovals.

I have found that if I keep stroking to try and totally fill in all of the spaces, that I am changing colors, which I don't want after a point. (Yes, you can minimize this by putting the slider for abstract color closest to the right--matching the image colors). So, what I did in this picture and another I just completed, is to switch to a regular paint brush, and paint in the small white specks or spaces that have not been filled in. Switching frequently to the eyedropper then back to the brush gets it done.

Funny you say you just got an Intuos--we must have ordered on the same day. I still have a lot to learn. Stroking back and forth is easier and quicker than with a mouse, and pressure definitely helps fill in, but I think the effect is "better" if I take many more lighter strokes. Many of the spaces will eventually fill in---I also play with the opacity or strength setting, quite frequently. This is the part, I believe, where only experience will show what works better and what does not work so well. And these will be different depending on the image.

The last thing I will mention is that since I am still in the "playing around" mode, I have not gotten systematic about trying different brushes and different brush settings apart from images. I think I need to do a lot of work just paining on plain canvas and cataloging the effects, eventually segregating the ones I like. (Have you explored all the levels of settings that can be applied to most brushes!! Amazing!) Maybe more will join in the discussion with what they have tried and learned and thus shorten the learning cycle somewhat. You can buy dozens of dozens of books on PS to help you climb that learning curve; no such books here with Deep Paint.

Keep sharing your experiences and learnings, and post some images when you are ready.

Thanks,

Ken
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  #14  
Old 02-08-2006, 03:51 PM
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byRo byRo is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken45140
...Deep Paint has orders of magnitude more adjustments, flexibilities and features...
Please correct me if I'm wrong, but it seems that you are comparing the "Full-blown" version of Deep Paint with the "watered-down" freebie Painter.
Although I do agree that the price may be the same.
Painter IX does indeed have a myriad of adjustments, almost too many.

Deep Paint vs.Painter....
As in many Arty things, I'd say much depends on your particular taste and style. My personal opinion is that Deep Paint is direct, quick and fun - especially if you like doing "Deep" painting as I do.
Painter on the other hand has done such a good job of translating Painting to the digital world that it also seems to have imported some of the difficulties.

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  #15  
Old 02-08-2006, 03:53 PM
stuart stuart is offline
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Your Brushstroke Technique

Thank you for the reply. Someone who has posted here on DP wrote me that checking the Fine Detail box mitigates the fill problem to some extent. I question if DP2 was designed for the Intuos.
In any case, my big question is what type of technique are you using to get somethng that looks like a painting rather than just a duplicate of the underlying photo in the clone mode ?
Yes, moving the slider toward abstract color helps in the color department but is not appropriate for all subjects (eg portraits).

Stuart
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  #16  
Old 02-08-2006, 03:57 PM
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byRo byRo is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken45140
...... no such books here with Deep Paint.
Quite a few of us around here have had a brush* with Deep Paint, so if you have any questions fire away. You won't go long without an answer.


*sorry, couldn't resist
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  #17  
Old 02-08-2006, 05:09 PM
Ken45140 Ken45140 is offline
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Ro:

Quote:
Originally Posted by byRo
Please correct me if I'm wrong, but it seems that you are comparing the "Full-blown" version of Deep Paint with the "watered-down" freebie Painter.
True, those are the only two I have. I realize that the $400 (or whatever it is) program will have as many and probably more knobs, but by staying in the "Free" category, I get a comparison of features per dollar so to speak. I also want to say I am not taking anthing away from PainterEssentials and tried to say that I am sure I will learn when I should use it vs DP.

Stuart:
I am sorry, I thought I spoke to your point. I have done several (several more below). I use various cloning tools and move the abstract color and fuzziness slides to several positions. I also change the type of brush, I sometimes check Canvas Texture, and also change Feather and Strength. Under one of the menus, I also play with jitter and smooth. In the flower vase previously published, I changed all of these very little. In the ones below of the "Old Man", I changed them more frequently. These are really crummy, I think, but I am sharing just for learning and to illustrate what I have been getting. Hopefully, technique and results will improve with experience. If you look closely between OldMan01RTP and OldMan01bRTB, you will see blotchy color differences. The former was with cloning oval and little rework, while the latter had a lot of hand painting with very small brushes.

Can you share some of your work, even if not "the best"?

I also wind up with something that is definitely not just a duplicate of the image, but also has a lot of "holes" and in some cases, color "blotches" that I do not like. That is when I have done touch up with regular paint as I described previously.

But hey, I have only done a total of maybe five "paintings", so all you are hearing is what I have done, not Truth.

Thanks,

Ken
Attached Images
File Type: jpg OldMan01bRTB.jpg (68.9 KB, 52 views)
File Type: jpg OldMan01RTP.jpg (73.1 KB, 63 views)
File Type: jpg OldMan03b.jpg (83.5 KB, 49 views)
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  #18  
Old 02-08-2006, 06:04 PM
stuart stuart is offline
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Re:Jitter & Smooth

Ken,
Where in DP did you find these brush controls ? I have seen these in Painter but not DP. I will do some posting of DP results soon.

Stuart
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  #19  
Old 02-08-2006, 06:58 PM
Ken45140 Ken45140 is offline
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Deep Paint Command Panel

Stuart: see the attached picture. An unbelieveable combination of variables that you can adjust. Hard to experiment with even a small subset of the combinations.

Ro: if some of those who you say has had a "brush" with DP could comment on which "knobs" are the most used, or the most influential, in achieving painted looks from photos, that would be very helpful. I realize most used and most influential are very hard to define...but if someone has found one or several to be "favorites" that could be quite useful.

Ken
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File Type: jpg A1.jpg (96.2 KB, 72 views)
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  #20  
Old 02-08-2006, 07:02 PM
Ken45140 Ken45140 is offline
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Stuart: have you done (or could you do) a side by side comparison. Same initial image, one done in Deep Paint and one done in Painter, attempting to achieve a similar end result. Seems like hearing your evaluation of the differences and seeing the two results would be very informative.

Thanks,

Ken
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