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Photo-Based Art Emulating natural-media painting techniques

Making a realistic old school high contrast Litho

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  #21  
Old 01-09-2010, 08:27 PM
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Re: Making a realistic old school high contrast Li

Thanks a lot. Lots of good ideas!
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  #22  
Old 01-09-2010, 08:36 PM
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Re: Making a realistic old school high contrast Li

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Originally Posted by csuebele View Post
Most likely one of the reasons litho has that look is due to film grain, both in the original and the litho film itsself.
No. Properly exposed "old school" ortho litho film for the most part had no grain in it at all unless it was deliberately done for a reason. The ortho-litho film was it took a normal color or black and white neg. or slide, and transformed it into a positive film that was then printed or used for reproduction purposes. The film sheet had clear areas that were dark on the negative that created clear areas which printed solid black, and solid blacks which printed solid white. The original purpose of this film was intended for use in graphic art projects - newspaper and printed materials and graphics for silk screen printing. It "just found its place in the hands" of photographers and darkroom techs for special effects.
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  #23  
Old 01-09-2010, 10:17 PM
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Re: Making a realistic old school high contrast Li

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Originally Posted by crabbyphoto View Post
No. Properly exposed "old school" ortho litho film for the most part had no grain in it at all unless it was deliberately done for a reason. The ortho-litho film was it took a normal color or black and white neg. or slide, and transformed it into a positive film that was then printed or used for reproduction purposes. The film sheet had clear areas that were dark on the negative that created clear areas which printed solid black, and solid blacks which printed solid white. The original purpose of this film was intended for use in graphic art projects - newspaper and printed materials and graphics for silk screen printing. It "just found its place in the hands" of photographers and darkroom techs for special effects.
Yes, for the most part, properly exposed litho film had very little detectable grain, but it did have grain which affected how the image developed out. In most cases this is not noticeable, but if you had a large areas of transitional gray, it would be more noticeable, as the litho film would build up a slight density in the developer first then towards the end of the process the full dark black would come in radiating out from the grain. Large light areas in the original negative could also have an impact on light spilling into the darker areas. Of course, you could also use Kodak's LPD4 to make direct positives rather than making an intermediate negative with a litho film like Kodak Kodalith Ortho Type 3.
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  #24  
Old 01-10-2010, 02:46 PM
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Re: Making a realistic old school high contrast Li

Yea Chuck I get ya - how old are you - I can tell you and Gunner didn't get on the bus yesterday!. I did not realize you were familiar. But for those who never had the good fortune to use the stuff - I find its the simplest was to describe graphic arts films..
AS for me for a small lab that just used the technique for EFX I didn't like to keep too many different exotic chemicals and films on hand as you know mixed kodalith developer had a short shelf life.. I usually kept Kodalith A&B Developer and standard ortho litho film I kept quite a lot of it from 35mm to 11X14, making everything from titles to screen printing positives. I wold buy it when I saw a good deal and keep it in the freezer ;-). Bought a lot of off brand stuff from FreeStyle Photographic and I see they are narrowing down their stock in these products as well - kinda sad.
I did on occassion use the reversable stuff usually in chemistry for some effects. I also used texture screens of all kinds including homemade. Shot in medium format. This would do cool things to those "grey areas" you mentioned. I also kept a 100foot roll of High Speed Recording film for cassette reloading. It made cool grainy prints too but I usually like pushed tri-X just as well. Did you ever develop a roll of B&W in wrong temperatures to get reticulation effects? Also did a lot of cross processing and doubles and sandwiches. I printed Cibachrome also. Did a lot of hand coloring and toning too.

Folks who only grew up in the digital world, "know not where they came" :-). Most every Craig's or Kubota effects emulate these old 70' and 80's effects whether darkroom, in camera or filtering. Now it just a push button knowing absolutely nothing about the actual process. What is done in one keystroke took us an afternoon to pull off.... Thats okay but I appreciate where it all came from. Its always humorous to me (in a good way) how so many of the techniques and effects so very popular in the 70 & 80's discussed at length on the pages of PHOTOgraphic magazine are so popular again now... Dig out some old LP album covers or the Rolling Stone and check the radical photography of the era.

I taught college level film photography and film and video production for about 20 years and forget there are more old timers around besides me - who embrace both sides of photography wet and pixels - its refreshing to find you guys!

Still searching for my perfect litho PS technique.
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  #25  
Old 01-10-2010, 02:48 PM
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Re: Making a realistic old school high contrast Li

Chuck.... Love your splash page.
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  #26  
Old 01-10-2010, 02:59 PM
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Re: Making a realistic old school high contrast Li

http://www.atomiccupcake.com/item.php?id=000386
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  #27  
Old 01-10-2010, 03:14 PM
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Re: Making a realistic old school high contrast Li

Interesting. Have you tried any of these actions?
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  #28  
Old 01-10-2010, 03:31 PM
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Re: Making a realistic old school high contrast Li

I borrowed this capture from the stock exchange. One thing that is extremely important in old photography is the consideration of grain. Also, like to highkey/contrast an image prior to the conversion too. I like using blends of a cool GIMP GEGL feature called C2G for the natural grain look. I did add some tone color to the grey as well.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg 1222630_40698121c2g.jpg (199.4 KB, 21 views)
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  #29  
Old 01-10-2010, 05:16 PM
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Re: Making a realistic old school high contrast Li

You might want to try this. I saw it on another site.

De-sat your background layer.
Create 3 empty layers.
On the background layer select Color Range-Highlights.
Fill the selection with white on your top layer and de-select.
On the background layer select the Shadows from the Color Range.
Fill the selection with black on the layer beneath the highlights layer and de-select.
On the layer above the background fill with 50% Grey.
That’s it. Don’t know if that’s what you’re looking for but that’s the way it was explained on the other site.

Joe
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  #30  
Old 01-10-2010, 06:40 PM
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Re: Making a realistic old school high contrast Li

Lyle, cool image and your right old images many times have a considerable amount of grain. However this is nothing like I am looking for

Joeven I am going to try your steps but i can see some corrections to it that might make it better . Thanks.
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