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Photo Restoration Repairing damaged photos

cities2forest

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  #11  
Old 08-11-2005, 10:42 AM
Racc Iria's Avatar
Racc Iria Racc Iria is offline
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Ahh, now I get it.

I thought Kraellin was trying to remove the haze from an image rendered solely by Terragen. And I was thinking why go through all that when you could just turn if off.

Nevermind. I understand now... I think.

--Racc
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  #12  
Old 08-11-2005, 01:15 PM
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Craig Walters Craig Walters is offline
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doonee,

ok, i think i'm following all this

yes, you could re-scale the vegetation for the far away stuff. that shld work fine. just remember to blur it a bit also.

Quote:
and the valleys are now competely bare of arboreal vegetation.
(i could also post a foto of how it looks there today, if you like).
yes, please.

when working with depressions, i'd generally recommend starting at the lowest point and furthest away. work toward the foreground and up the back of the depression first. as you move forward and up, you simply clone over what's already there as needed and wanted.

there's also another way to do all this if you want to lessen how much you clone. you could make a new layer with nothing but samples of vegetation, or make several layers each with its own type of vegetation. using a hide-all mask over these layers, you could simply turn the black mask into a white mask where you wanted the various vegetations to show through on the original picture.

or, you could make separate images of all the various vegetation types and clone from there onto the original.

or, you could cut and paste whole selections of vegetations into the original, though that may be a bit rough and not match up very well.

you do want to be a bit careful with your cloning. you've got areas in your original that in shadow from the various hills, so you'll want to match those areas up with shadowed vegetation also. or, you could overwrite shadows onto these areas with various methods.

from what i've seen so far, you're doing fine. if that original terragen was mostly denuded of forest, then the picture you posted is really quite good. same with the picture where you're putting in all that dark green forestation over the urban area.

and as for that distant glow, you could just clone vegation over it and add the 'glow' back in later with some simple masks and color balancing/mixing.

Craig
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  #13  
Old 08-11-2005, 02:42 PM
doonee doonee is offline
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Quote:
if that original terragen was mostly denuded of forest, then the picture you posted is really quite good.
the actual area today is totally denuded.
however, I textured the terragen render green where i intend to paste footage. (using footage colours as a base).
so far, ive proceeded to the foothills of the first steeper slopes.
from there to the back, its all the texture of the terragen render.

Quote:
as for that distant glow, you could just clone vegation over it and add the 'glow' back in later with some simple masks and color balancing/mixing.
hm yea, this glow stuff still throws me off quite a bit....

most of the footage i had choosen comes with some kind of a distant haze.
(sorry racc, i guess i didn not explain that vey well earlier on)

without beeing able to properly remove and add that haze at will, my choice of material to clone is limited, since i cant clone (scaled down) darker stuff from the front of the footage next to lighter stuff in the back of the pic.

One way to get rid of the haze so far was a plugin called Metrix
(http://www.panix.com/~jnr/), which does rid you of the haze but also
of quite some detail as well. I also used that trying to adjust differently coloured forest footage in order to use it inside the same picture (for example in ssa.jpg).

Then, to get the haze back, i experimented by creating a lightblue gradient semi transparent layer and placing it over the entire pic, but i didnt like that very much.

Matching the natural haze of the underlying picture is another issue.
One thing i did at first was to try to have the terragen render haze match the haze on the footage, but that did not work too well.

Non-matching angles of footage forests and base-picture is another thing.
(not so much with terragen, since you can render a picture that mimicks the angle of the footage)


Quote:
you do want to be a bit careful with your cloning.
Surely i do want to.
Note that it stops where it gets harder to do.
The cloning in the front of the pic is easy.
It even shows entirely cloned small hillsides which simply cover the terragen render. (I was actually experimenting with skewing the footage, and then liked the results and kept them)
In mid and far distance, however the cloning has to match slopes and depressions etc, and, as you point out, also shadowed areas.

Quote:
when working with depressions, i'd generally recommend starting at the lowest point and furthest away.
good one ...

Quote:
you could overwrite shadows onto areas with various methods.
sounds like a very good one too, but leaves me clueless

Quote:
using a hide-all mask over these layers, you could simply turn the black mask into a white mask where you wanted the various vegetations to show through on the original picture.
again, no idea ..

Anyways, all you saw here are quite 'ad hoc' experiments, just to get started, some shots in the dark to see if i can extensively use Photoshop in this project.
And i think that a whole lot can be done.
One has to start somewhere, right ?

What strongly speaks for Photoshop, in my opionion, is the following:
One visual effect i wish to create with all this is RECOGNITION.
the viewer is suppoed to recognize the degraded area beneath the forest.
(thats something which the intuition of the brazilian audience will be
the final judge of).
i have already produced some beautiful renders of paradisical scenery in VUE, but they dont cut it, because theres no immediate way an unprepared viewer will recognize the location between all that greenery, even though i had used high resolution heightmaps and made sure to include as many geographic features as i could. All my test audience saw was beaches and forests, which could have been *anywhere*.
Ideally, ive noticed when showing these pics to people, i must work with a series of before/after pairs, which *exactly* match in POV, angle and all, except for the orginal vegetation.
Thus, manipulating existing photography of well known motives is not a scaperoute but a prime solution, since it naturallay implies exactly matching POVs.
The only trouble is that i dont know Photshop.

I'm very happy I came here, because you're doing the right thing by throwing the proper keywords at me, and thats exactly what i was looking for.


Please, if you're up to it, if you know a tutorial concerning the subjects you mention, throw the link in with your comments ...

thanks again, craig
(picture following shortly)
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  #14  
Old 08-11-2005, 03:05 PM
Racc Iria's Avatar
Racc Iria Racc Iria is offline
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doonee...

Can you post the DEM image you were using, the matching Terragen render, and the photo you are trying to match it to. I'd be interested to see them all at once.

I'm assuming they aren't the ones you've already posted since the perspectives and terrain don't seem to match. Or am I missing something?

--Racc

Last edited by Racc Iria; 08-11-2005 at 03:11 PM.
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  #15  
Old 08-11-2005, 03:08 PM
doonee doonee is offline
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racc
which one ?
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  #16  
Old 08-11-2005, 03:13 PM
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Any of them, as long as it's a complete matching set. Meaning, the DEM image used to generate the terrain in Terragen, the image that you rendered from Terragen, and the photo that you're trying to match it to.

--Racc
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  #17  
Old 08-11-2005, 03:26 PM
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Craig Walters Craig Walters is offline
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i'm on my way out for now, but caught your post, so i'll give you some quick answers.

generally, if you watch an oil painting artist paint, they start on the background first and work forward. this is because they are going to cover up portions of the painting as they work. it's just MUCH easier than working from the foreground to the background.

for creating shadows, the first thing that comes to mind is adding a new blank raster layer to your image. paint it black or nearly black. then, simply adjust the opacity setting of the layer to be more transparent (less opaque). this will allow the underlying layer to show through and essentially blend your black layer with the base layer giving the impression of a shadow wherever you have the black painted. there's more to it, but that's the basic part.

the glow can be done several ways. in subtracting it, make a selection around the area you want to remove the glow from and simply use a channel mixing or color blending tool to reduce the blue effect. i used the Fast Fix plugin to do it on your terragen image and it worked quite well. i selectively masked the area i wanted to change, changed the mask into a selection and applied fast fix to the selection. when you have a selection up like that and apply something to the image, it ONLY affects the part in the selection. once you have what you want, you simply kill the selection and your change is imparted to the image.

in adding glow back, additive this time, this can also be done several ways. again, the simplest way is probably with adding a blank raster layer like we did with the shadows. only this time, it's going to be a glow we're creating instead of a shadow. the trick is to paint in something that will come across as a glow when we make this layer less opaque. several things come to mind for that. you could 'add noise' and blur it. you could simply paint something in, a white with a blue tint here and there or something else. this doesnt have to be exact. and it most probably wants to be 'hazed' or blurred. so, simply use a blur tool, like soften or gausian, and blur this 'haze'. you might also want to vary the density of the paint when creating it. the density setting exists for almost any brush you paint with. think of it as how many bristles on a brush have actual paint on them. so, when you paint, if the density is turned down, you wont actually be painting a solid line. it will have misses here and there depending on the density setting. once blurred, this shld give a varying haze look to your applied image.

layers are like pieces of paper stacked on top of each other. the thing that makes them work is the opacity setting. a solid image sitting on top of another is only going to show the top 'piece of paper'. but these pieces of paper have an adjustable opacity to them that you can alter. thus, if you can partially see through the top layer, you get the effect that the underlying layer shows through and 'blends' seemingly, with the other layer. i know you know part of this, but i'm not sure how much, so forgive me if i'm 'talking down' to you or going over things you already know.

you might also be able to affect your glow with 'adjustment layers', but we can take that up later

Quote:
Then, to get the haze back, i experimented by creating a lightblue gradient semi transparent layer and placing it over the entire pic, but i didnt like that very much.
play with that some more. that's exactly what i'm talking about. try different degrees of paint and tints and opacities on the layer. try some blurring or adding noise and blurring. there's more you can do here to vary this, but that involves masks, and like i said, i'm heading out the door here

Craig
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  #18  
Old 08-11-2005, 03:56 PM
doonee doonee is offline
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racc
yes, of course
ill get you a matching ter, tgw + reference pic


(would you like textures and footage as well ?)
(whats your preferred terrain size ?)

rgds
d
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  #19  
Old 08-11-2005, 03:58 PM
doonee doonee is offline
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craig ...
np.

no rush ...
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  #20  
Old 08-11-2005, 04:01 PM
Racc Iria's Avatar
Racc Iria Racc Iria is offline
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Quote:
(would you like textures and footage as well ?)
Yes, everything you're working with. Once we can see that we'll have a better understand of the challenge you're facing.

Quote:
(whats your preferred terrain size ?)
Ideally, the size you intend your final output to be. However, we'll have to settle for the size limitation here unless you can host the originals somewhere else and provide a link from which to download them.

--Racc
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