[dave-ek]

hi all can you help me out

i do lots of fashion retouching and i have a problem darking down backgrounds
the way i do it at present is to fist of all have my dublicate retouch layer then i make new layer and choose overlay and have a 50% grey fill then i paint over this layer with black at about 20% opacity and build it up. now this works great with BW but with colour it can start to bring out colours even on a grey background, do any of you know how to darken colour pix without any colour shift??

[Frank Lopes]

Would Color Burn do the job for you?

Originally Posted by dave-ek

hi all can you help me out

i do lots of fashion retouching and i have a problem darking down backgrounds
the way i do it at present is to fist of all have my dublicate retouch layer then i make new layer and choose overlay and have a 50% grey fill then i paint over this layer with black at about 20% opacity and build it up. now this works great with BW but with colour it can start to bring out colours even on a grey background, do any of you know how to darken colour pix without any colour shift??

[dave-ek]

Originally Posted by Frank Lopes

Would Color Burn do the job for you?

hi frank

thanks but it seems to do the same (if i have done it right)
how is it you would do it. i just need a neutral darkening (burning)

cheers

dave

[Daviskw]

Just wondering why you don't use a curves layer set to luminosity mode. Then either mask out or pick a small feathered area to darken then use a mask and brush at low opacity to build up shading where needed. I believe the luminosity mode should reduce color shifts.

Butch

[1STLITE]

Or make an empty layer set to Luminoisty, and paint black on what you want darkened? If I am understanding the problem exactly, I think it would work,

[Frank Lopes]

Post a sample we'll have a go at it

Originally Posted by dave-ek

hi frank

thanks but it seems to do the same (if i have done it right)
how is it you would do it. i just need a neutral darkening (burning)

cheers

dave

[dave-ek]

many thanks to you all for your help both the curves in luminosity and the new layer luminosity methods work well with no colour shift.

my method with the new layer/overlay/50% grey served me well for most work but when i need a heavy darken then it shows a slight colour shift.

so thanks again my problem is solved

dave

[edgework]

Originally Posted by dave-ek

hi all can you help me out

i do lots of fashion retouching and i have a problem darking down backgrounds
the way i do it at present is to fist of all have my dublicate retouch layer then i make new layer and choose overlay and have a 50% grey fill then i paint over this layer with black at about 20% opacity and build it up. now this works great with BW but with colour it can start to bring out colours even on a grey background, do any of you know how to darken colour pix without any colour shift??

If you just paint in luminosity mode you're going to avoid the color shift but you'll also avoid the whole point of using overlay. Luminosity mode will obliterate the underlying pixels, while overlay interacts with them, which is the point.

Two ways to accomplish your goal, both involve performing a copy merge to a new layer. You can set that merged layer to luminosity mode, then put your overlay layer on top of that, and make sure it's grouped to the luminosty layer. All the darkening/lightening, none of the drift. You can also do the same thing after the dodging and burning with your overlay layer. Copy merged to a new layer, set that layer to luminosity mode and turn off the underlying dodge/burn layer, since it's now been incorporated into the luminosity layer above it. Either works, for the same reason.

You might try hard light mode, instead of overlay (though at a low opacity). Opacity leaves the hightlights and shadows from the underlying image alone, whereas hard light will darken/lighten everything. Depending on your requiremnets, it might be a better option.

Also, the 50% grey is irrelevant for this type of task, since it has no effect in overlay, soft light or hardlight (or any of the other dodge/burn modes as well). It is convenient, I guess, for letting you see your strokes, if you really need to see your strokes, but you'll see the effects of them anyway in the image as you work. It doesn't hurt anything to include the 50% gray base, but neither does it contribute anything.

An exception to the above is using an overlay layer for adding noise (highly desirable since overlay mode won't dirty up the highlights and shadows). Since adding noise always works with a random distribution lighter and darker from the existing pixels, starting with 50% grey insures that the image won't overall darken or lighten from the added noise. That's the only time it helps.

[dave-ek]

this sounds good but can you tell me how to do it step by step ( i am a simple soul) as i have tried it but not too sure if its right.

cheers

[edgework]

Originally Posted by dave-ek

this sounds good but can you tell me how to do it step by step ( i am a simple soul) as i have tried it but not too sure if its right.

cheers

Copy merged to new layer. Set to Luminosity mode.

create new layer in Hard Light Mode or Overlay (Soft Light will give a similar result as Overlay, just... softer). Group with Luminosity layer.

I use a tablet, pressure sensitive, 5% opacity and set my foreground and background colors to white and black. The "X" key switches them. Set your brush size to no larger than the areas that you are working on. Build the effect slowly, a bit at a time. If you want something faster, more dramatic, raise the opacity on your brush. I usually use for skin balancing, dodging and burning the light and dark imperfections so low opacity works best, making sure no single stroke stands out. If you're just darkening areas, you won't need to be quite so precise.

[dave-ek]

thanks very much for taking the time to help, i will give it a try.

[ray12]

Here is a way to interactively darken a background.

I will often just take the original layer and duplicate it. I will make the duplicate layer be on the top - and set it to Multiply mode. This makes the picture VERY dark all over.

I then add a black mask to this top layer - this makes the darkness go away like it wasnt even there (looks like the original picture again).

I then paint on that black layer mask with a soft, low opacity, WHITE brush. Where ever I paint it gets darker, the more I paint the darker it gets. I control the location and strength by going over the same place a couple of times. This gives me subtle control.

If I go too far - or I dont like what im seeing - I just hit the "x" key and paint with the BLACK brush - and it selectively restores the lightness back where ever I paint. This gives me total control.

If one layer of this darkening is not a dark enough - I just duplicate that top layer one more time - and it gets really strong. I usually end up putting a mask on that layer too - or just use maybe 15 to 25% of its strength via the opacity slider. That makes the overall darkening adjustable.

I like this method because it keeps the colors correct - and I can totally control where the darkening gets placed - and how strong it is - and I can reverse the effect at will till im artistically satisfied.

Ray

[stosh7]

Manipulating luminance without affecting color is a classical reason for working in LAB color mode. The "L" channel containsluminance only data so editing there has no effect whatsoever on color content.

The L channel in LAB is also a good vehicle for sharpening, whereas noise can be removed without losing sharpness by blurring the "A" and "B" color channels.

It seems to me that your original technique would work very well if applied only to Luminance.

Your final solution can easily be converted back to RGB or CMYK without losing detail or color shifts by using Image>Mode>Convert to Profile with Dither unchecked..

Try it ... you'll like it.

Stosh