Photo Retouching - - Need help creating "flawless" skin (glamour)

bullys1974 · #1 10-07-2006, 02:10 PM

hi all... i spend the last two days reading this forums... a great place to stay and i am not new to retouching... i read about dodge and burn techniques and about the dior skin tutorials. so i decided to try these new techniques on my lovely wife dana...
here is the result.. i am not happy with this...
1. original file
2. removed all wrinkles by myself
3. blurred and highpass from here : http://dgrin.smugmug.com/gallery/1169397 but i got lots of shadows on the hands an chin ...
4. dodge and burn thechnique...wich made me cry

can u please help out and give some tries on my file.. i put it here: http://www.ml-artdesign.com/dana_ret.tif its 9 mb ... pls share your work.. i am especially interested in how to dodge and burn...i read all the threads here but it is never really explained... i found the d&b - set but my try was horrible and just flattened out the skin... i even didnt make much darker.. just lightened the skin

its even more uneven and blotchy

pls help ... i want to recreate a flawless skin and the look of the glamour mags...diorlike models...like shellby shows on hers http://www.retouchme.co.uk/ .. i like that work very much...
regards... mario

TheVeed · #2 10-07-2006, 06:13 PM

You need good photography and make-up to create a glamour look. You have to start off with the right product to get that finished result.

I think you need to practice your dodge and burn technique, as well. Practice makes perfect, remember. Don't rely on blurs or filters.

bullys1974 · #3 10-08-2006, 12:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheVeed

You need good photography and make-up to create a glamour look. You have to start off with the right product to get that finished result.

yeah..i know.. apart from that i dont think that this is too bad photography for an amateur photographer...)

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheVeed

I think you need to practice your dodge and burn technique, as well. Practice makes perfect, remember. Don't rely on blurs or filters.

thats the point... how to do that ? i cannot practice if i dont know how ? i just lighten up the skin ... just clicking around makes no sense...would like to see how you would do that in this particular pic.. so i can practice..pls help

thx
mario

Gary · #4 10-08-2006, 01:10 AM

- healing brush tool to smooth out the skin and match colors in areas that are blotched, lines under her eyes, etc - done on separate layers so that the opacities can be adjusted,
- Chip Springer's Paint With Light(Color) II action found at http://www.atncentral.com/download.h...e_Enhancements
using a white soft brush and very light opacities to decrease shadowing and again, using skin color to balance any areas that the healing brush didn't fix or match properly,i.e. her finger tips, chin area, etc. At atncentral, there are also other 'glamor' actions that you may like.
- image/adjustments/shadow/highlights to lighter her hair as well as increased midtone contrast to highlight her eyes
- added a dark vignette to a duplicate layer, adjusted the opacity and masked out any over-effect,
- sharpened the lightness channel of a duplicate in LAB mode, pasted back overtop of the original and applied a 'hide all' layer mask to allow applying the the effect only to specific areas by painting them with a soft white brush. i.e. eyes, lips, hair.

bullys1974 · #5 10-08-2006, 02:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gary

- healing brush tool to smooth out the skin and match colors in areas that are blotched, lines under her eyes, etc - done on separate layers so that the opacities can be adjusted,
- Chip Springer's Paint With Light(Color) II action found at http://www.atncentral.com/download.h...e_Enhancements
using a white soft brush and very light opacities to decrease shadowing and again, using skin color to balance any areas that the healing brush didn't fix or match properly,i.e. her finger tips, chin area, etc. At atncentral, there are also other 'glamor' actions that you may like.
- image/adjustments/shadow/highlights to lighter her hair as well as increased midtone contrast to highlight her eyes
- added a dark vignette to a duplicate layer, adjusted the opacity and masked out any over-effect,
- sharpened the lightness channel of a duplicate in LAB mode, pasted back overtop of the original and applied a 'hide all' layer mask to allow applying the the effect only to specific areas by painting them with a soft white brush. i.e. eyes, lips, hair.

wow thx gary.... thats the help i search...
u have done very very well... a little too good perhaps ... but thats not the point...
u didnt use any blur thechnique ?
can i use the pwl action for dodgeing and burning ? that atn creates 1 grey-layer ... i read that it is not so good like a burn and a dodge curve ?

any other tries ?

regards mario

edgework · #6 10-08-2006, 04:45 PM

Biggest problem was the lack of contrast. I bumped the contrast to give a little more shape to the face and added a touch of glow, made the lips a little glam and enhanced the eyes. Skin smoothing and lots of healing brush.

http://edgework.tripod.com/samples/dana.jpg

crex · #7 10-08-2006, 06:13 PM

Something like this ?

Gary · #8 10-08-2006, 06:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bullys1974

wow thx gary.... thats the help i search...
u have done very very well... a little too good perhaps ... but thats not the point...
u didnt use any blur thechnique ?
can i use the pwl action for dodgeing and burning ? that atn creates 1 grey-layer ... i read that it is not so good like a burn and a dodge curve ?

any other tries ?

regards mario

Thanks. Yes, the ATN sets down a grey layer in Soft Light mode so, instead of using the dodge and burn tools, you can use a black brush to darken and the opposite to lighten. Dodging and burning are great tools but for me, this method is more effective and less 'color damaging/changing' for this type of project. Also, you can select any color within the project and use this to increase saturation, smoothing, etc by simply changing the brush and layer opacities.

As for smoothing, I neglected to state that I used Dynamic Skin Softener filter within the NIK Color Efex Pro bundle on a separate layer so that I could adjust the effect and mask out those areas that I wanted untouched.

Cheers!

Cassidy · #9 10-08-2006, 07:46 PM

Pure painting with light is arduous to say the least, especially when starting, maybe meet it half way with a DeGrundge via Byro's method http://retouchpro.com/tutorials/index.php?m=show&id=213
and then finish off with painting with light. As you get the hang of it maybe drop the degrunge opacity more and more. This way I'd think it should not be so overwhelming. I am by no means any expert, just my two cents

PS. BTW, don't forget about things such as curves and levels adjustments

bullys1974 · #10 10-09-2006, 06:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by edgework

Biggest problem was the lack of contrast. I bumped the contrast to give a little more shape to the face and added a touch of glow, made the lips a little glam and enhanced the eyes. Skin smoothing and lots of healing brush.

http://edgework.tripod.com/samples/dana.jpg

that looks really nice and i will remember the bumping of the contrast and the glowing for the lips... thx

@crex: this looks also really fine.. what was ur way ?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cassidy

Pure painting with light is arduous to say the least, especially when starting, maybe meet it half way with a DeGrundge via Byro's method http://retouchpro.com/tutorials/index.php?m=show&id=213
and then finish off with painting with light. ...

PS. BTW, don't forget about things such as curves and levels adjustments

how about using curves for smoothing skintones ... if i add adjustment curves.. i can only edit the 3 colors rgb , dont i ? so i have to add loads of curves, right ?

thx
mario

Cassidy · #11 10-09-2006, 06:31 AM

"how about using curves for smoothing skintones ... if i add adjustment curves.. i can only edit the 3 colors rgb , dont i ? so i have to add loads of curves, right ?

thx
mario"

that sounds even more arduous to me, Iwas talking about a basic curves and levels adjustment before starting off or on finishing off

bullys1974 · #12 10-09-2006, 07:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cassidy

"how about using curves for smoothing skintones ... if i add adjustment curves.. i can only edit the 3 colors rgb , dont i ? so i have to add loads of curves, right ?

thx
mario"

that sounds even more arduous to me, Iwas talking about a basic curves and levels adjustment before starting off or on finishing off

ahh ok..i do that normally always... on this image not yet

but i thought of curves with masks on every seperate color to even skin tones...
but that would just be another way than pwl right ?

Cassidy · #13 10-09-2006, 08:02 AM

Doing it that way, I think, would give more scope to skewing the colour

bullys1974 · #14 10-09-2006, 08:23 AM

ok... ty all... hav to work on these tips... i will post another result...

but if u like .. i , and i think others too, would be very pleased to see other approches and explanations...

regards
mario

Syd · #15 10-09-2006, 11:38 AM

First off, let me say, I am no expert on this, having only recently begun to experimenting with this technique myself but perhaps I can give you some pointers.

Actually, I think you did very well on your D&B effort. With just a little more work it could look good. I took the liberty of taking your D&B and ratcheting up the contrast a bit to show you where work needs to be done. (Attachment 1)

Then I had a go at it myself, and although it is by no means perfect, I include it to show you the general direction in which you should be moving.
(Attachment 2)

For what it's worth (and please bear in mind I have very little experience in this) here is my two cents on D&B. Here I must also give credit to TheVeed who gave me some very valuable pointers. He advises to start big (say at 100 - 200%) and then, if necessary to zoom in closer. I use a 2-10% opacity brush, with a flow of 50%, a hardness of 25% and a size of anywhere from 1-50 pixels although most work is done at about size 10.

Some other tips....zoom in and out constantly, add a curves adjustment layer to bring out the contrast. This will show you areas you haven't seen. Get up from your desk and stand about a meter away from your computer. You will see more from here. Switch off all the lights in the room. This will give you yet another angle. Leave your computer for a while. Go and do something else. Come back again with fresh eyes.

Can't think of anything else now. Hope this helps.

Syd