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The demystification of dave hill! let's all help!

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  #431  
Old 01-22-2008, 11:23 AM
longside1 longside1 is offline
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Re: The demystification of dave hill! let's all he

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Originally Posted by Mtmm View Post
There is no software that can align bodyparts what are at different angle in every shot. And of course, flash recycle time is way too slow for rapid fire. As said, 3 cameras would also be at different angle. It would be also insanely expensive setup to use for example 3x1Ds mkIII, 3x24-70/2.8L and another problem would be to set all the cameras to fire at the same time syncing with flashes. And for the record, Dave Hill himself said that "it would be about impossible to shoot HDR with humans".
Thanks for confirming that Mtmm! We know DH makes composites, often placing his foreground subjects on separate backgrounds so I suppose there is nothing stopping you from placing your portrait subjects on a HDR'd background. This I feel is the only extent to which HDR is relevant to this discussion.
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  #432  
Old 01-22-2008, 12:00 PM
enigmaphotos enigmaphotos is offline
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Re: The demystification of dave hill! let's all he

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Originally Posted by Mtmm View Post
And for the record, Dave Hill himself said that "it would be about impossible to shoot HDR with humans".
Well I guess that's it then, if DH says so.

Anway.... I do know a guy who is beta testing new Photomatix software with 'better' movement algorithms. In fact the current version even has a pop at it. It's not great, but it does try some. Who knows what the newer algorithms and greater range sensors will do in the future.

I speculate that eventually it will be done, just as you speculate it won't.
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  #433  
Old 01-22-2008, 12:04 PM
longside1 longside1 is offline
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Re: The demystification of dave hill! let's all he

with the greatest respect, if Dave Hill said that he doesn't use HDR, why are we still discussing it?

Is there any chance that we can get this thread back on topic?
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  #434  
Old 01-22-2008, 12:14 PM
Mtmm Mtmm is offline
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Re: The demystification of dave hill! let's all he

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Originally Posted by enigmaphotos View Post
Well I guess that's it then, if DH says so.

Anway.... I do know a guy who is beta testing new Photomatix software with 'better' movement algorithms. In fact the current version even has a pop at it. It's not great, but it does try some. Who knows what the newer algorithms and greater range sensors will do in the future.

I speculate that eventually it will be done, just as you speculate it won't.
Relying just on basic fysics, it´s not possible. You know Enigma, when shooting with several flashes like Dave Hill, recycle time is so slow, that it´s not just about ghosting effect anymore, it´s a different image with different angle and position.

If you are taking 3 different exposures, it will take about 2 seconds to fire flashes 3 times. How in the world you can align that? You cant, just face the facts. And I´m talking about moving subject, like jumps or anything. Look at behind the scenes by Dave Hill and that shoot where they are using trampoline. Does the Photomatix freeze humans in the air for 2 secs?
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  #435  
Old 01-22-2008, 12:20 PM
Mtmm Mtmm is offline
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Re: The demystification of dave hill! let's all he

And here is again, Dave Hill himself.

Quote:
I haven't used HDR or that tone-mapping stuff. I just recently heard about it, and it seems you need to bracket your images to do it well. That would be almost impossible when shooting humans! :-) ......snip
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  #436  
Old 01-22-2008, 03:09 PM
enigmaphotos enigmaphotos is offline
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Re: The demystification of dave hill! let's all he

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mtmm View Post
If you are taking 3 different exposures, it will take about 2 seconds to fire flashes 3 times. How in the world you can align that? You cant, just face the facts. And I´m talking about moving subject, like jumps or anything. Look at behind the scenes by Dave Hill and that shoot where they are using trampoline. Does the Photomatix freeze humans in the air for 2 secs?
I'm not saying in the future you will use three (or more) exposures. What I'm trying to say is that, in the very near future, all you will need is one exposure. The way technology is growing the camera will be able to see the same as the eye... in fact better.

But what do I know. I've only been taking photos for about 10 years+, and I know people that are actually testing new software. Look up HDR hallucination. (It seems the world will always be flat). Maybe look up Moore's Law

Anyway... back on topic I think. If it makes you feel better, then I agree with the current technology, you can't take moving objects with (true) HDR. But it aint far away.

Anyway... back on topic.

Last edited by enigmaphotos; 01-22-2008 at 03:25 PM.
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  #437  
Old 01-22-2008, 04:31 PM
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superkoax superkoax is offline
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Re: The demystification of dave hill! let's all he

Let's just end the HDR PORTRAIT for now!

I'm very interested in moving it towards models on different backgrounds! Lookup the Dan HEder shoot from the behind the scene on DH site! First he shoots him in a kitchen shoot, and then the playground pictures! the playground shoot he places him on different background and the kitchen shoot he uses the same background! different post productions but same result/feel!
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  #438  
Old 01-22-2008, 11:04 PM
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namphoto namphoto is offline
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Re: The demystification of dave hill! let's all he

Back to Basics with NAM

HDR = High Dynamic Range

Why would we need a high dynamic range in flesh tones. With technical use of lights, you can bring out your highlights without blowing them out and bring the detail in your shadows using fill lights, reflectors, etc.

HDR is something you need in landscapes where the dynamic range differs as extremely as the sky and the earth, which cannot be captured in a single exposure.

@Enigma, why do you have this obsession with HDR portraits. Im not saying its not possible because DH dont do it. I could care less what he says, but he doesn't do it for a reason. too much work, for results you can produce with a little more careful work. There isn't an quick answer for a 'retouch pro'.
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  #439  
Old 01-23-2008, 01:25 AM
charliebrown charliebrown is offline
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Re: The demystification of dave hill! let's all he

hey guys!...I have been reading this ENTIRE FORUM for about 2.5 hours now

I live in a humble town called Murfreesboro Tennessee in the US.

I, like yourselves, am in a never ending quest to create pictures similar to Dave Hills.

yes I have lucisart but everytime I try and use this I get really grainy nasty skin tones?

any ideas?

I read in a forum that Dave Hill was actually in...and someone asked him..Dave I dont want to steal your secrets but how do you do it dude?

and he replied "two words!....LUCIS ART!"

maybe it was a fake or I was dreaming hah..

but I have my TRIAL PICTURES...as well

http://www.flickr.com/photo_zoom.gne...1808306&size=l

I did not do this next image but beilieve it is very close...

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2232/...18027945_b.jpg

but when he tried to explain it all...I got lost

sry for the LONG post guys
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  #440  
Old 01-23-2008, 08:07 AM
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snook305 snook305 is offline
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Re: The demystification of dave hill! let's all he

You can HDR from the One RAW file and just run it out as 3 different exposures...
Also he may not be using Lucis Art but you can a similar look in RAW by playing with the Fill light exposures or do the same thing in Shadows and Highlights..
That is what dave hill is doing most likely.
In any case it is not a one step plug-in.
You should know a bit about photoshop, Masking etc..otherwise you will be way lost.

Also I saw in a backstage shot's by Dave that he has a guy on set there doing the photoshop.. not Dave Hill.
Also Dave Hill is nothing new! He has simply copied Ficus and greenberg but marketed it to a Newbie Rock band market...:+}
This technique has been around much longer than Dave Hill for sure..:+}
Snook
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