The demystification of dave hill! let's all help!

[Mtmm]

Yes and you need to generate enough good highlites to work with. You can always do more shadows, but from a flat image, its pretty hard to do more highlites.

[Cyberek]

I have mentioned about luminescence masks before, and yes, it is good way to do local (in luminescence level meaning) contrast increments, or any other correction based on luminescence. And also, if You can do masks like they describe, You can do much more (of them), to control more or less that you like . Its depending, what You want to get . But its just a tool. Using the tools in correct way, correct tools to work, that they are best fitting it... and maybe we should talk more about, which method gets us where, not like: do this, and this, and that, and set this like that and this will work :P. It always depends on image, and on how far and which dirrection You want to go .
Here is something, that I was working recently:
http://img168.imageshack.us/img168/4...74edit2yo9.jpg
Spent about 4-5 hours on correcting the skin (clone stamp on lighten/darken on very low opacity, some other techniques), then correcting whole picture, masking, and corrrecting again, and so on... just becouse last needed it (beleve me, that with original, just correcting to this color/mood was lookind very ugly).
Oh P.s.... and photo was taken in full sun light, couse that are the frends of mine, and i didnt had any other equipment than my camera with only one lens... we did some grilling together (yes, no bogos, no flash units, no reflectors...).
PsPs... anybody want to share his/hers feelings about this photo?

[snook305]

I guess the questions is where is the saturation and grain coing into Dave's Pictures..
~He has the shiny sheen to the clothing and skin.
Mtmm I like the way your skintones are coming out but I still feel you are leaving out some info which is fine.
Again no one is forcing to answer this.
I guess your trying to save the huge BodyBuilding market in Slovakia that we are thinking about invading this year...:+}
Just a little humor...:+}
IF your doing just lighting and DBing can you post one of your images in psd or with layers showing that somehow?
I think one of the helpful retouchers there are are like Amy Dressler who even post one of her images with layers showing people. then she added her "trick" technique of filling leyer with white ect...... That is cool..
That is someone who cares o less if people know what she is doing and like to help.
with your contrast or luminosity mask are you darkening the darks and lighting the lights or opposite?
Snook

[snook305]

Originally Posted by Cyberek

I have mentioned about luminescence masks before, and yes, it is good way to do local (in luminescence level meaning) contrast increments, or any other correction based on luminescence. And also, if You can do masks like they describe, You can do much more (of them), to control more or less that you like . Its depending, what You want to get . But its just a tool. Using the tools in correct way, correct tools to work, that they are best fitting it... and maybe we should talk more about, which method gets us where, not like: do this, and this, and that, and set this like that and this will work :P. It always depends on image, and on how far and which dirrection You want to go .
Here is something, that I was working recently:
http://img168.imageshack.us/img168/4...74edit2yo9.jpg
Spent about 4-5 hours on correcting the skin (clone stamp on lighten/darken on very low opacity, some other techniques), then correcting whole picture, masking, and corrrecting again, and so on... just becouse last needed it (beleve me, that with original, just correcting to this color/mood was lookind very ugly).
Oh P.s.... and photo was taken in full sun light, couse that are the frends of mine, and i didnt had any other equipment than my camera with only one lens... we did some grilling together (yes, no bogos, no flash units, no reflectors...).
PsPs... anybody want to share his/hers feelings about this photo?

Yeh and you mushed all the contrast and information in the image..
looks pretty muddy.
I have been doing luminosity masking for contrast for years.
if you command click the image in the channels and then load that to curve mask, I use pigment not percent and bummped the midtones up 10 points and then invert the slection or mask and do the oppisite you will get a "perfecty" contrast image as you are not affecting the colors just contrast in the luminosity channels.
This is pretty old school technique that I still use today, but that does not produce the DH look.

I think that some are not mentioning and I am not totally sure my self but where is all the saturation coming from.. sponging...:+}

Also would like to add that dave does not ever say he does not use any plug-in and when he says he does not HDR I tink he is full of it as it is impossible to get his backgrounds images with out HDR odf some sorts.
I don't beleive a word ~Dave hill says as he is obviosly worried about holding the secrets of his post work.
Maybe he is not HDR his backgrounds, but his retouch or the person doing his backgrounds is and that is obvious and he is a fool for saying differently.
Snook

[rystro]

"With your contrast or luminosity mask are you darkening the darks and lighting the lights or opposite?"

Not sure if there is a correct answer to this. All photos are different. There are many different levels of Lum Masks you can have. 'Darks', 'Super Darks', 'Lights', 'Wide Lights' etc.... so you adjust to taste.

With Lum Masks you are basically emulating HDR to an extent. HDR has info in the darks and info in the lights because you have different exposures that has capture that information. With Lum Masks you can bring up pixels in the shadows and bring down the lights giving you a balanced luminosity.

BUT if that information (or pixels) isn't there to begin with... well then your kind of screwed.

[rystro]

Mtmm, do you have an online gallery of your work? The only work I've seen are the tidbit posts here and there on this thread? I would love to be able to browse through your work. I'm impressed.

BTW adding noise can cover some sin, not all but can help if used in small amounts.

[Mtmm]

Originally Posted by rystro

Mtmm, do you have an online gallery of your work? The only work I've seen are the tidbit posts here and there on this thread? I would love to be able to browse through your work. I'm impressed.

BTW adding noise can cover some sin, not all but can help if used in small amounts.

http://www.pakkotoisto.com/mike/

[rystro]

Originally Posted by Mtmm

Yes and you need to generate enough good highlites to work with. You can always do more shadows, but from a flat image, its pretty hard to do more highlites.

That and its hard to bring up lower-midrange without generating noise so a good fill light (like a ring flash) will help.

[TreesOfMyTime]

Originally Posted by Mtmm

http://www.pakkotoisto.com/mike/

That is some pretty awesome work! You deserve all the accolades you get (and you deserve to make money on it all as well), Bravo!

[snook305]

Originally Posted by Mtmm

And you have now discovered that mystery? Please, dont hold it down, shot us how to replicate Dave Hill´s style if it is so simple. There is hundres of users trying to replicate that style, nobody has done it. So please, enter the stage. You fail!

And for the record, I´m not trying to copy Dave, but I have learned a lot from his videos.

http://www.bodynet.fi/kuvat/danielhill.jpg

Guy in that photo is named Daniel Hill, just a coincidence.

??
And please do the same..:+}

S.

[Mtmm]

I have no glue how Dave does his photos, so I have nothing to reveal.

[TreesOfMyTime]

Originally Posted by snook305

??
And please do the same..:+}

S.

Where can I find his videos?

[snook305]

Mtmm why you keep beating it down.
You keep beating around the bush.
We would like to know how you are getting that Dave Hillish look you are doing..
Does that sound better.
No one wants your exact steps..
Your doing something besides D&B ing and your 3 light set-up
I just saw this response you left and wonder why don't you do as you asked to others so many times and give a little more information.
Like you said it all depends on the subject anyways.
Can you be a little more specific.. you working only in PS. what bleach pass you talking about? which one. Nik color fx one?
I think even dave gives more info than you...:+}
Snook..

[Mtmm]

I use 4 lights and I need more. I can only say what I do use and it depends on a photo. I will not give any details.

d/b
local contrast
local multiply blending
highpass/gaussian smoothing in linear light blending (very effective and clean with right numbers)
duotone blending
local clarity and exposure (raw)
black channel sharpening
color correction by numbers (CMYK)

Don´t ask for details. One thing is a must - ringflash as a fill light, I love it.

disclaimer:
This is valid only today, tomorrow I can use another methods.

[TreesOfMyTime]

Originally Posted by Mtmm

I use 4 lights and I need more. I can only say what I do use and it depends on a photo. I will not give any details.

d/b
local contrast
local multiply blending
highpass/gaussian smoothing in linear light blending (very effective and clean with right numbers)
duotone blending
local clarity and exposure (raw)
black channel sharpening
color correction by numbers (CMYK)

Don´t ask for details. One thing is a must - ringflash as a fill light, I love it.

disclaimer:
This is valid only today, tomorrow I can use another methods.

I have everything else, I just need a ring flash! More money and mostly more time doing all this PS work! Thanks anyway!