Skin Retouch - inspired by GodMother's video

[KR1156]

ziaphra, we're just trying to help this person, maybe they aspire to be hi-end.

getting feedback from guys like ant is about as close as you're gonna get to working under the wing of someone at a hiend retouching house, over the internet.

honest criticism is way better for them than sugarcoating anything and saying way to go champ.

it really helped me a lot, maybe i just have thicker skin. but we were all at that point at sometime.

[cricket1961]

Originally Posted by KR1156

i'd rather have no retouching on my images than bad retouching.)

Ziaphra

This is actually a pretty common statement in the industry, coming from both Photographers and instructors. It is not meant to be derogatory in any way. Although there are a few people that have managed to use it in a most destructful way.

Chris

[edgework]

Originally Posted by Ziaphra

I do know what you mean but tactless comments (meant or not) via the anonymity of the internet still dig, especially when one is trying so hard to learn.

This website is called "RetouchPro," not "Retouch Hobbyist" or "Photoshop for Fun." If the name means anything, it's necessary to stop pretending that sloppy work gets a pass. Good intentions mean nothing and tender feelings belong in a playpen.

In my other life I was and am a student and writer of poetry. A teacher long ago set the context for everything I've tried to do subsequently: he said "If you want to be taken seriously, and you want to take yourself seriously, face the grim fact that you're not competing with your classmates, or poets in magazines, or even the poets in this anthology. You're competing with Shakespeare. That's the bar that's been set, and if that's not the standard you aspire to, do something else." No less true for the creative efforts here.

mrbeagle, good for you, putting your work out there for all to see. And, it would appear, for listening. You seem to recognize that trying isn't enough. Actually, "trying" is just a P.C. way to avoid saying "failure." The only thing that counts is doing it right, and if it doesn't make the cut, there's no amount of spin that will compensate. And the only way to do it right is to spend a lot of time doing it wrong and learning to avoid whatever things you tried that made it wrong.

It's not about how you feel about your efforts, or about how anyone else feels either. It's about the image. And when you learn to look at an image you've just spent ten hours slaving over, and can deliver the same cold assessment that KR1156 gave, then you'll be about halfway there.

In another thread, Ant offered a marked up critique of someone's efforts. It wasn't blunt, or cruel, it was accurate. If one of the art directors I work for saw your image, it would come back with numerous red marks on the overlay (we call them "Slasher Shots"). Why don't you beat everyone to it, and provide your own markup. Be a real a__hole about it too. Have no pity or consideration for the retoucher's feelings. In fact, try to crush the poor sap's spirit. When your reflex to complain about your own work exceeds your instinct to defend it, you will improve dramatically.

[pixel_monkey]

It’s never easy to swallow when you think that you’ve created a masterpiece and someone comes along and points out all the faults that you need to improve upon. It might sound absurd, but a good part of the learning process of being an artist is to learn how to handle criticisms. I’d rather have my work critiqued, and perhaps, ripped apart by an industry professional than getting a pat on the shoulder by my family and friends. Your skills will eventually stop improving if there’s no one there to challenge you and you will fall behind.

[KR1156]

i get my work crit. on a daily basis, by very hi-end and veteran retouchers, and i love it and appreciate that they take the time.

i've learned a ton in the last year. invaluable info. from these critiques.

as long as the criticism is constructive, appreciate it.

for me personally, i think the most challenging part, or area i find most difficult, is color. I've worken on some amazing photography lately, and just when i think i did great, i get areas pointed out where the color is suspect. but that's what is making me better every image.

plus, i put in a ton of time practicing all night long on hirez images, and it finally paid off.

[mrbeagle]

Originally Posted by KR1156

as long as the criticism is constructive, appreciate it.

definitely feel the same

[AdamZx3]

The skin lighting needs evened out on her forehead, it looks almost bumpy from the shadows. The lighting on the whole model is very contrasty, I might try and lighten up her left side a bit, but I guess it depends what look your going for. (or the photographers )

[Oh_Heck]

Is it just me....or is her fake eyelash on her right eye loose..

Hope you don't mind me playin a bit with this picture. Its a good one to learn on for skin, and I need all the practice I can get. I used the technique on this site this time around.

http://www.photoshopsupport.com/phot...is_202-215.pdf

Tried to blend in some of the different tones a bit...probably overdone, dunno. Starting to stock up on magazines though so I can get some reference.

Didn't touch the white of the eyes yet....trying to work out how to approach that without having it look flat and fake..

[mrbeagle]

ok I'm back for more....
I went for a whole different workflow this time trying to take some of the advice in the thread (thanks all by the way!)

soooo I dialed everything way down (well tried to). It's funny this morning I swore that was the best retouch I've done. I came back tonight and looked and it and I could see it was blotchy as hell. I see what you guys mean about leaving and coming back after a few minutes.

anyway, here is a new before after with the same image.

thanks

[mrbeagle]

forgot to ask, the new edit... same, better, worse?

[Smokie]

mrbeagle the first retouch you have done on this image you have made the skin look wicked ( kink of like a lizards skin in a wired kind of way) and i just want to know how you did it?

i think it will look cool on one on my images

[cricket1961]

Looks a lot better than the first attempt. Still has a crossover of colors in the flesh. Need to balance it out. You have yellows. blues, magenta and pinks going on.
You really need to clean out the whites in her left eye. Also try to open up the iris on the eye in shadow just a little. It will add to the depth of the image. Soften down the hair below her nose and above her lip a little. Don't take it away though. There is a white bump/spot under her bottom lip that needs to go. Eyelashes on the left eye on the top row only should be more uniform. There is a crease coming out almost from the stud diagonally down to the left that should be removed. As well as some of the darker creases in the bottom lip. She has a small bugger in her nostril.
As I mentioned if you wish to send me the hi res to my ftp I will mark it up for you. Just let me know.

Chris

[KR1156]

pretty nice improvement from the first, it's now at a much better starting point. Follow chris' lead and you'll be in a good place. nice going.

[mrbeagle]

thanks Chris,
I'm not even sure how to tackle that left eye yet because it has so much going on. Do I mask it out, then paint white, lower the opacity then go in and do some d&b on any remaining spots? heal it? clone it?

[mayday]

[quote=cricket1961;166677]Looks a lot better than the first attempt. Still has a crossover of colors in the flesh. Need to balance it out. You have yellows. blues, magenta and pinks going on.

Like KR1156 was saying I can find colour issues troublesome as well! I try to go by the number but sometimes still get some unexpected colours.

Chris what would your best method be to balance things out?
Would you just pinpoint the colour shift areas in curves chanels and adjust by numbers and eye? Do you ever find it good to desaturate some chanels like the red? I'd apreciate and tips or advice