Boosting Black Boosting Whites

[_ManWithNoName_]

This is kind related to my other Thread.

How do you boost the blacks / the whites to give that high contrast example below.

http://ebrusidar.net/gallery/view.php?lang=en&image=516

I'm getting better and Im using Lum masks to isolate the Light, Light Lights e.t.c and performing a curves or levels or contrast adjust. Still not getting the results Im after or Im afraid to push it too much.

Any more advice on this is welcome...

Cheers...

[snook305]

Hey looks great.. maybe a tad too dark in the edges but very nice. you'll have to see how those darks print up..
Good job
Snook

[_ManWithNoName_]

Sorry.

I knew I should have clarified. This isn't mine, but as you can see the blacks are black and the whites white...

[mando-matic]

I think an aggressive S curve would do it in a Curves Adjustment layer.

[SEP Studios]

I'm guessing high contrast film is involved. The range of tones, even in the "white" images, is amazing.

It would be helpful to see the original you're working from.

Scott

[_ManWithNoName_]

Again. Still struggling with this.

This is the type of thing again Im talking about http://josefhoflehner.com/

What Im playing with is Luminance Masks Of Lights and Darks, Curves e.t.c
Wondering if I could also combine (just thought of) Overexposed, Underexposed and Normal image and blend highlights and shadows from each??

Any more for anymore

D

[seattle-light]

Man, this shouldn't be so complicated. Start with well exposed image (no blasted whites or filled in blacks) that's got a wide tonal range and that's been captured in Camera Raw (so that you've got the bit depth needed to move the information around without creating a lot of banding). Bring it into Photoshop and make sure you're working in 16-bits per channel (as you will need the extra tonal information to make this work successfully). After bringing it into Photoshop, use a black and white Gradient Map adjustment layer to convert it to black and white (you may then need to do some additional layer adjustments under that gradient to tweak the pre-conversion to address dullness, color pollutants, etc. as you would with any black-and-white conversion). Then use a Curves adjustment layer and move bright areas up and the dark areas down -- you're sacrificing midtones for highs and lows (and this is where the Camera Raw and 16-bit become essential, because when you push the tonal information to those extremes those remaining midtones get pulled apart and will look terrible -- coarse, chunky, banding -- if there's not enough information there to work with). Then you can add adjustment layers to gently tone the image. This will give you a small stack of simple adjustment layers that will get you most of the way there. Now you can do retouching on a layer over the original image and make other adjustments as needed just as you would with any regular color image (always do cleanup before adjustments in the layer stack). I would put a soft light layer over the Gradient Map layer and do D&B there (because your B&W D&B is going to be different than what you'd do in a color image, and it's simpler because you're just using black and white and low opacity brushes) to selectively adjust drama prior to the extreme contrast Curve (easier to do the D&B before the extreme contrast in the layer stack). Let me know how it works out.

[artist1961]

the simplest way is to do it on Photoshop , make sure your forground and background color are Black and white go to IMAGE> AJUSTMENT>gradient map... and your image will turn black and white now click on the gradient and adjust the amount of black and white you need

if you have any pic i can give you the example

feel free to as any Q if u have


is this what u want

http://i28.tinypic.com/r09yyt.jpghttp://i28.tinypic.com/r09yyt.jpg

[seattle-light]

I suppose that's a pretty cool way of getting it "all done" in one adjustment layer. I'll have to try it out on some images (I can some situations where it could be really useful). And it will actually work in those instances where images are already ideally suited for the conversion. But in the real world most images need a bit (or a lot) of finessing.

If you look at Ansel Adams prints, you might think they were just amazing captures (great composition, right place, right time, right exposure -- lucky shots). But if you you thought that you'd be wrong. They weren't just lucky shots of great locations.

The fact is he spent a lot more time in the darkroom perfecting his images than out in the field shooting (he was a master of the art of photographic printing. And the magic was in taking a solid capture and obsessively fine tuning it through dodging and burning (and a host of other techniques to reveal what he saw when he was shooting). If you look at some of his raw negatives or early work prints made from them, his master works are basically unrecognizable -- his true genius was in the coaxing out of the negative what already he had already seen in his mind's eye.

If you turn the conversion into a simple, one-step process, you don't allow yourself the room for exploring the real potential of an image which is going to come out through a lot of subtle adjustments. Sometimes you'll get lucky, and it will work beautifully. But there are going to be lots of time when you won't get lucky, and then the approach simply doesn't give you the tools you need for that situation.

The one-step solution is also it's weakness. First of all, the Gradient Map is not the most intuitive interface for fine tuning adjustments and building your extreme high contrast into the same adjustment layer as the black and white conversion doesn't give you any flexibility through opacity in toning down your adjustment because when you lower it's opacity then you're also diminishing the black and white conversion.

And it doesn't allow you to selectively dodge and burn the "raw" black and white file before applying the high contrast to it. It seems to me that the real fine tuning that is going to make these image sing is going to be taking place after the black and white conversion adjustment but before it's hit with the extreme contrast Curve adjustment. And most of the work that is actually going to make the image sing is going to be done in between those two adjustment layers while they're also both on so that you can visualize what you're doing in real time.

Trying to fix the underlying subtleties after making an extreme adjustment just isn't going to work.

Sometimes putting everything together in one layer adjustment doesn't simplify things. It just ties your hands and makes it harder for you to do what needs to be done.

In my mind, I see these files layering out like this:

(top of layer stack)
--any color balance or tonal adjustments to create the color mood of the black and white (after you get everything else perfected, and probably very subtle)
--Curve to add the contrast
--selective adjustments and dodge and burn to bring out the drama of the image (this are a lot easier on the now "raw" black and white image, and it's much easier to make these changes before the extreme contrast is added into the mix than to try to fix problems afterward)
--Gradient Map to black and white (linear with no adjustments)
--adjustments to color to optimize the black and white conversion (usually made after the gradient so you can see how the changes affect the image)
--cleanup and retouching of the color image (often more than one layer)
--original
(bottom of layer stack)

[Quantum3]

I never thought using a gradient map would change a color picture into black and white. Amazing! But I'm wondering why the image look in colors when adding the gradient with an adjustment layer. I tryed all the pertinent blending modes and the background layer still shows its colors instead, by using the command Image/adjustments/Gradient map the image turns into black and white instantly.

Any solution for that?

Thanks guys!

Mart

[seattle-light]

Hey Mart...

If you use the gradient map as an adjustment layer in Normal mode it will give you the black and white you're looking for. If you use another blending mode like soft light it will apply the same black and white "gradientized" information as soft light (which would enhance the overall contrast of the image). Multiply would make it darker and grayer. Etc.

Using it in an adjustment layer will of course not affect the color information in the lower layers when that adjustment layer is turned off -- this allows you to have all of the original unaltered color information below. This allows you to work non-destructively (and that gives you greater flexibility down the line), but of course the file is bound to get bigger (but if it's an image worth working on then it's usually worth the size and a larger file is easier than keeping track of a whole bunch of different versions so you can go back and change something in the color file and then convert it again into grayscale so you can fix something and then add the contrast again). The point of using a adjustment layers is to adjust the appearance of the images without impacting the underlying information. You can always duplicate layers and merge them if you need to (but that can often seriously limit your options going forward).

An example would be if you wanted to use Liquefy to move some information around. But make sure that you label that merged layer (so you'll remember what it is) and save the mesh so that if you need to change something below in the layer stack you can fairly easily duplicate the layers and merge them again and apply that same mesh in Liquefy to get right back to where you were (but now with the underlying changes in place).

Maintain flexibility and reduce having to do the same things over and over (but never being able to get them exactly the same). In the long run, it saves time and frustration while opening up possibilities.

[Quantum3]

Originally Posted by seattle-light

Hey Mart...

If you use the gradient map as an adjustment layer in Normal mode it will give you the black and white you're looking for. If you use another blending mode like soft light it will apply the same black and white "gradientized" information as soft light (which would enhance the overall contrast of the image). Multiply would make it darker and grayer. Etc.

Hi mate,

I added a gradinet map by using an adjustment layer and left the blending mode in normal. I just see the gray scale gradient map and not the photo. It's supposed I should see a black and white photo, isn't it?

Thanks for your reply,

Mart

[seattle-light]

Hey Mart...

That's definitely a puzzling one. Are other types of adjustment layers working properly for you?

[amica999]

Originally Posted by Quantum3

Hi mate,

I added a gradinet map by using an adjustment layer and left the blending mode in normal. I just see the gray scale gradient map and not the photo. It's supposed I should see a black and white photo, isn't it?

Thanks for your reply,

Mart

Are you sure you use the Gradient Map and not a gradient Adj-Layer?

[seattle-light]

I think amica999 is on to something here.

Maybe it's a subtle semantic difference, but it's an important distinction. An Adjustment Layer is different from making an adjustment to a layer.

You need to create a Gradient Map adjustment layer (rather that applying a Gradient Map to an adjustment layer). And I probably wasn't entirely clear, so please accept my apologies if I sent you down a path to confusion..

Try this over your image.
Layer>New Adjustment Layer>Gradient Map (then select the grayscale gradient). Make sure that the blending mode is Normal and that the opacity is set to 100%.

Good luck, and let me know how it works out.

[Quantum3]

Originally Posted by seattle-light

...probably wasn't entirely clear, so please accept my apologies if I sent you down a path to confusion..

Good luck, and let me know how it works out.

Hey no problem... You're very helpful from the beginning. I've never ever seen the gradient map in the adjustment layers menu... It's a new feature of CS4 or CS3 also has it? I'm wondering because I use photoshop since the version 5! lol!!!

Ah, by the way, I found it! =D

Thanks a lot for the enlightening, mate

[Quantum3]

Originally Posted by amica999

Are you sure you use the Gradient Map and not a gradient Adj-Layer?

Hey Amica, you knocked the right door. I was adding just a gradient haha... Thank you very much for pointing there...

You also been very helpfull!!!

Thank you very much Amica,

Mart

[amica999]

Originally Posted by Quantum3

Hey Amica, you knocked the right door. I was adding just a gradient haha... Thank you very much for pointing there...

You also been very helpfull!!!

Thank you very much Amica,

Mart

no problem, you are welcome. Glad it worked now

[_ManWithNoName_]

Thanks all for the responses.

I've read thru them but not had a chance to go into them in depth yet Just did a quick G-Map on the image in my original link.

I can see if you add multiple GMaps it deepends the blacks and lightens the whites. So I will have a play with this method and the others mentioned.

I also agree with the above. Photography is more than the camera, it's the printing. I think it was Micheal Kenna or Rolfe Horne that shows his techinique. You see the original image, which isn't all that, but after he's done his printing, the image is 200% better.

Not got any images to work on just yet, but may bump this thread again...

Cheers..

[HelloPiccadilly]

some similar stuff by http://www.michelrajkovic.fr

[_ManWithNoName_]

Cheers.

Been following him for a while and inspired this thread...