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Skin texture?

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  #21  
Old 01-13-2010, 11:11 PM
fotogen fotogen is offline
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Re: Skin texture?

C79, Looking at differences between images 2 and 3, in image 3, the redness of the skin is gone and the contour of the face on the right side of the image, models's left side, is modified and seems smoother. The images looks a bit yellower, more natural skin tone. Was all of this done with general D&B. Can you please tell me what brush size, flow you used to paint the D&B layers into the image? Did you do lower the saturation in images 3 at all?
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  #22  
Old 01-13-2010, 11:48 PM
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Cuervo79 Cuervo79 is offline
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Re: Skin texture?

Quote:
Originally Posted by fotogen View Post
C79, Looking at differences between images 2 and 3, in image 3, the redness of the skin is gone and the contour of the face on the right side of the image, models's left side, is modified and seems smoother. The images looks a bit yellower, more natural skin tone. Was all of this done with general D&B. Can you please tell me what brush size, flow you used to paint the D&B layers into the image? Did you do lower the saturation in images 3 at all?
As I mentioned, when I do D&B I also add a layer to color the skin, this is done with a solid color layer with a blending option of color and an opacity of 40%, you have to try different places to pick up the color (look at the shadows first) in order to get the best looking color. I also mentioned that I do 2 types of D&B 1 takes care of the general shadows and blotchy parts of the skin (a more general one) which is why you see it as smoother. And then a D&B that focuses on the pores themselves.

Brush sizes vary, depending on the photo so I don't recommend a special size since you'll have to select it depending on your photo and your zoom. The same thing happens to opacity but I can tell you here that I go from 5 percent to 30 percent in opacity and flow.
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  #23  
Old 01-14-2010, 12:07 AM
fotogen fotogen is offline
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Re: Skin texture?

C79, your tips are invaluable. I am learning so much. Thank You.
Just to clarify, adding a color layer with color blending mode is for the purpose of evening out the skin tones, correct? I guess one would layer mask this layer and then brush in the color to all over the skin?
One more really stupid question, I never figured out with "brush flow" means and what effect it has. Can you please help me with that?

Thank you again for your time and effort in helping me
Hadi
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  #24  
Old 01-14-2010, 06:13 AM
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flexmanta flexmanta is offline
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Re: Skin texture?

Cuervo79 seems to follow the same workflow i do, so i have a question for him.
See, i am currently practicing separating frequencies to work on them separately. Basically i end up with 2 main layers, a low freq one, and a high freq one. I d&b on an overlay layer on top of the hf layer to smoothen the "good" texture of the skin. The low freq layer contains all the bad stuff, and is usually the one that hold all the color irregularities. So, i have been doing different things to get rid of those irregularities with different techniques.

I have used good ol alienskin skin smoothen, median, surface blur. They all work perfectly. I'd like to know what choice did you make regarding that, fixing the low freq. As seen on your samples, from 2 to 3.
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  #25  
Old 01-14-2010, 10:53 AM
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Re: Skin texture?

@Fotogen the main task of the solid color layer is to color parts where I worked D&B because when doing it it changes the tone of the skin sometimes it becomes gray or loses its original saturation, currently I'm in the process of deciding if to use it on all the skin or just on the D&B parts (originally I used it on all of the skin) on the example I posted it looks better on all of it but that I think is because of the heavy makeup the MUA added. Regarding the flow you have to play with this in order to see what it does, I never really did any tests if it works better than just adjusting opacity but its what works for me right now. For example if I want something really soft I have the opacity set to 5 percent and the flow to 10 If I want something considerably stronger and "faster changing" I go 20 20. As I see it the more flow you have the faster the brush reaches the opacity percent so to me it gives me a bit more control. Remember I haven't done any real testing of this this is only what I think it does LOL.

@flexmanta
When I'm doing the degrunge technique I follow the same workflow: Healing and clone, a bit of general D&B and on the top of that serveral layers of degrunge (I don't have 2 layers separate I end up only with one) and use different values for the high frequency I start at 15 and go down in multiples of 3, the low frequency is always 1/3 the value of the high. But this only happens if the "main" technique is degrunge. If the main technique is D&B I don't do this I only do dodge and burn.

The examples I posted have NO degrunge (high/low frequency separation), its all healing, cloning, D&B, and a separate layer to change the skin tone.
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  #26  
Old 01-14-2010, 11:16 AM
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flexmanta flexmanta is offline
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Re: Skin texture?

Cool. Yeah, thats what i used to do, but have recently found out that, by separating frequencies i can get almost any effect that i need depending on what I do with each texture size. Im tellin you, im really impressed with it. Currently i am trying to adapt it to my workflow. In the past, i would just have a duplicate of the original, and i would do all my cloning and healing there plus a retouchers overlay layer for D&B. But now, i can go as far as i need with each part, since affecting one doesnt change anything on the other (if properly separated). I have even been able to median the c**p out of the low pass layer without making the skin look anything other than realistically flawless.
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File Type: jpg separated.jpg (93.6 KB, 205 views)
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  #27  
Old 01-14-2010, 11:36 AM
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Cuervo79 Cuervo79 is offline
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Re: Skin texture?

Can you post more examples? I can tell in this one the classic "mushyness" that the degrunge technique sometimes leaves. I've tried to use it to replace D&B but it doesn't have the same look.
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  #28  
Old 01-14-2010, 12:52 PM
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flexmanta flexmanta is offline
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Re: Skin texture?

This is not the degrunge technique. Degrunge (never used it) is done by low passing one layer, and high passing the second layer on hard light 50% opacity. This frequency separation is done by duplicating layer, bluring the first one, and substracting the detail of the non blured one with the apply image comand.

The mushyness comes mainly from the evenness of color in the low frequency layer, the detail on the high frequency layer has been dodged and burned as if i was dealing with one single layer containing it all. After the frequency separation, the image stays intact, no noticeable difference. It just gives you the freedom of touching the parts separately (color imperfections on one layer, and texture on the other). That way, d&b will cause no color shifting. The point of this all, is not smoothing the skin by lowering the opacity of the texture layer, or inverting a high pass layer (which is simply horrible).

http://img689.imageshack.us/img689/160/99259042.jpg
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  #29  
Old 01-14-2010, 02:10 PM
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Cuervo79 Cuervo79 is offline
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Re: Skin texture?

Thanx for putting more examples... I can see now that the "mushyness" I was refering to is just a blotchy part next to the right nostril that its a bit enhanced by the desaturation of the skin.

Was the technique you use taken out of the "highpass sucks thread" in MM?
I read the description of the last action and when I did it it was exactly what I do in the degrunge technique (only I later changed the highpass layer for the apply image technique written in the original post) the only thing is that it let you independently adjust the high and low separations...

Can you describe your high/low separation technique in steps?
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  #30  
Old 01-14-2010, 02:34 PM
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flexmanta flexmanta is offline
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Re: Skin texture?

Got me, it is the high pass sucks technique. I retouch in 16bits most of the time, there is an action that will do it all for you. Basically, what you do for an 8 bit image is:

-duplicate layer
-Blur 3-4 pixels on the lower layer (you want the low layer to contain all the color imperfections, so dont blur it to complete smoothness).
-Then, on the top, unblured layer, apply image. Suybtract, scale 2, offset 128. Then set that layer to linear light at 100%.

Unlike degrunge, with this technique, separated layers will look exactly the same as the unseparated single layered image. All what's left is to work the layers differently. You can even use plugins to work with the low pass layer (bad texture), as the goal is to make it really smooth as the good texture is preserved on the high freq layer.
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