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my first retouching with D&B method

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  #1  
Old 03-13-2012, 04:23 PM
KostantinosG KostantinosG is offline
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my first retouching with D&B method

Hi guys
this is my first retouch with D&B
can I have some feedback please
thanks

http://www.flickr.com/photos/konstan...in/photostream
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  #2  
Old 03-13-2012, 04:59 PM
fotogen fotogen is offline
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Re: my first retouching with D&B method

It looks really good, specially as your first one. Typically I would like to see the image at 100% to tell, but this one I can tell that skin looks really natural. The changes to the hair look pretty good too.
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Old 03-13-2012, 05:28 PM
KostantinosG KostantinosG is offline
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Re: my first retouching with D&B method

Thank you!
You know I'm just considering about the time... It took me like 7 hours to do that!!!
I think it's too much...
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  #4  
Old 03-13-2012, 05:33 PM
fotogen fotogen is offline
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Re: my first retouching with D&B method

You'll get faster at it. It used to take me about 8 hours for everything, including skin, hair etc... but I am down to around 5 hours. I don't know if it can be any faster. Typically, close up beauty shots take around 4-5 hours, mostly skin and hair.
I am still really bad with hair, but after 4-5 hours of retouching skin, I am sick of looking at the image and don't care much about the hair anymore, hence I put the hair up in most of my shoots
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Old 03-17-2012, 04:30 PM
skoobey skoobey is offline
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Re: my first retouching with D&B method

I think you are doing soemthing which I am trying to quit doing.

It's a bad habit called "perfect layers" and "perfect images".

Better way of doing things, and the one which I am applying now is to work visually. Look at the image, go away from the image, look back at the image, and only fix things that distract you most one at a time.

Don't worry if it's a bit chaotic, or if not everything is perfect.

It will save you A LOT of time, and it will turn out more-realistic images in the end.

So, don't go area by area, but always look at the big picture.

Thanks kav for the tip, it was a game changer.
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  #6  
Old 03-18-2012, 07:45 AM
toxic_snake toxic_snake is offline
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Re: my first retouching with D&B method

If you keep practicing, you'll be a really good retoucher someday, you have a good eye in spotting what needs to be fixed, however there are few things that needs to be addressed:

-You've overdodged under her eyes and over her nose bridge, you should try to tone the brightness down in both of those areas, specially the eyes.

-Some of the skin texture seems over retouched, try adding a little texture back.
-Her teeth look a little off, try brightening them.
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Old 03-18-2012, 11:27 AM
KostantinosG KostantinosG is offline
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Re: my first retouching with D&B method

Thanks Toxic for your advice, I really need people to say their opinion, that makes me improving my work
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  #8  
Old 03-22-2012, 08:05 AM
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JDClosser JDClosser is offline
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Re: my first retouching with D&B method

Hey KostantinosG,
I think you over did it...it's to be expected your first time. My biggest pet pev though is the freckles have been removed. Try leaving some natural features like that in..it will make for a much more believable edit. Also the highlight on the nose needs to have a better transition. If you have not seen them already I would highly suggest the "the art of dodge and burn" and Natalia Taffarel's workshops if you are fortunate or DVD.
I hope this helped.
Cheers,
JD
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  #9  
Old 03-22-2012, 01:43 PM
kav kav is offline
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Re: my first retouching with D&B method

This really isn't bad for starting out, even if it's an incredibly simple image. You just need a better understanding of shapes. You killed a couple transitions somewhat, and the lip goes flat rather than rounded because you treated the area as if it's intended to be a single tone/color. It's a really common mistake.

Quote:
Originally Posted by skoobey View Post
I think you are doing soemthing which I am trying to quit doing.

It's a bad habit called "perfect layers" and "perfect images".
That's a slightly strange way of describing it. I said that you needed to look at what you want to change and make the changes more directed rather than stare at a curve tweaking the points bit by bit attempting to achieve the contrast that it's lacking. Some things just have to be built up in steps.

Quote:
Originally Posted by fotogen View Post
You'll get faster at it. It used to take me about 8 hours for everything, including skin, hair etc... but I am down to around 5 hours. I don't know if it can be any faster. Typically, close up beauty shots take around 4-5 hours, mostly skin and hair.
I am still really bad with hair, but after 4-5 hours of retouching skin, I am sick of looking at the image and don't care much about the hair anymore, hence I put the hair up in most of my shoots
I kind of went through that a very long time ago. It's what happens if you don't know where you're actually going with the image. I can tell you right now, most skin doesn't take hours and hours to fix. Transforming really frizzy hair into smooth hair can take a long time if you're trying to remove all of the cross hairs and knots and stuff, but even then some people spend too long on it. With skin if you're spending that long on average, you don't understand it well enough. Quite often if you get the flow of the lighting and the color to look good, and remove any acne in a a seamless manner (meaning when you click the layers on and off, you shouldn't notice a true interruption in the grain of it or flats spots in the lighting), it starts to look a lot smoother and much less intimidating. Zoomed in burning and dodging it for hours and praying for smoothness is just an extremely bad way to go about it because you lose perspective for your goals there. This stuff doesn't have to seem unending. You just need to know what you want from the image, and you should have a very steady hand. Even working digitally, scribble work shows.


Quote:
Originally Posted by JDClosser View Post
Hey KostantinosG,
I think you over did it...it's to be expected your first time. My biggest pet pev though is the freckles have been removed. Try leaving some natural features like that in..it will make for a much more believable edit. Also the highlight on the nose needs to have a better transition. If you have not seen them already I would highly suggest the "the art of dodge and burn" and Natalia Taffarel's workshops if you are fortunate or DVD.
I hope this helped.
Cheers,
JD
I disagree with you on dvds. If you want to make a popular dvd, you make something that is graspable rather than powerful. That's the problem. D/B is barely any different from shading a drawing and applying finishing details. You should know anatomy extremely well. You should know how it looks under different lighting situations. The fundamental concept of burning and the techniques that are generally used are extremely simple. The reason you see a lot of bad work is due to poor judgement, lack of skill, and bad comprehension of the subject matter. If you look at a jaw, you need to retain the muscles that would move if you expect a realistic result. In the case of the OP, some areas either went or already were a bit grey, and the OP made the common mistake or replacing an area containing shape with a flat tone. Again he/she needs to know more about anatomy than burn/dodge techniques. The lip where it's altered now has no curvature. The nose is missing parts of its structure. Sometimes I make mistakes like this even today, but the recognition kicks in over a matter of seconds or minutes rather than hours. I like that the OP tried to fill in the hair a bit, but that skin beneath it definitely looks too bright relative to the other highlights in the image. Little stuff like that will get you.

Last edited by kav; 03-22-2012 at 03:04 PM.
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  #10  
Old 03-28-2012, 01:30 PM
capice capice is offline
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Re: my first retouching with D&B method

thanks for sharing your 1st try here Konstantinos, this enables me to learn from the comments on your post...
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