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Steven Klein, Mert and Marcus, all frauds.

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  #81  
Old 03-26-2015, 03:18 AM
blohan blohan is offline
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Re: Steven Klein, Mert and Marcus, all frauds.

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Originally Posted by Repairman View Post
blohard needs to get a few things straight in his head. The objectives of commercial photography and by extension post production, are to produce images that satisfy the requirements of the paying customer. This may be a product shot, scene or concept that benefits from the artistic input of the photographer but their 'vision' will be corralled by the primary objective which is to crystallise someone else's ideas into a coherent image.

Artists do not have to justify their work and can indulge their fantasies all day long without regard to time or interference. If they are really good they may even make a living but we all know that isn't how it works for most of us. However there is no shame in doing good work as part of a team and there is craft in setting up a process that delivers the goods. Bitchin about it is pathetic and tantamount to howling at the moon.

Importantly, we have no idea what the objectives were on the Madonna shoot, the circumstances or how long the photographer had access to her so the vehemence of blowhard's comments are both disproportionate and inappropriate. Keep your ideals blowhard but make space for other peoples too.
You are embarrassing, not only do I know all of that, but I also know the relationship Madonna has with these quacks. They are friends and they can shoot her for as long as they want, she just doesn't know they are making her look this horrific, in fact, she doesn't even know these outtakes are out, she's that out of the loop, so stop bringing excuses for their quackness when you literally don't know anything about it.

And I'm not even going to answer the other things you said because they aren't even applicable, she wasn't advertising for anything, these were for fashion magazine spreads, where they are allowed to be artistic. The original shots look horrific because the people doing the shooting don't know anything and are absolute quacks, that then get their work built up from scratch on the computer which is not the point and purpose of retouching, it's not to do the photographer's job for him, why is it so hard for you to get that into your fvking thick skull??
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  #82  
Old 03-26-2015, 06:05 AM
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Repairman Repairman is offline
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Re: Steven Klein, Mert and Marcus, all frauds.

Ah well, we tried. Hope you find a job soon.
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  #83  
Old 03-26-2015, 06:24 AM
skoobey skoobey is offline
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Re: Steven Klein, Mert and Marcus, all frauds.

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Ah well, we tried. Hope you find a job soon.
Or a therapist.
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  #84  
Old 03-26-2015, 06:41 PM
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Benny Profane Benny Profane is offline
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Re: Steven Klein, Mert and Marcus, all frauds.

I'm pretty sure this is why Madonna has a small security staff around her at all times.

Last edited by Benny Profane; 03-26-2015 at 07:18 PM.
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  #85  
Old 03-27-2015, 06:40 AM
jklier jklier is offline
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Re: Steven Klein, Mert and Marcus, all frauds.

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Originally Posted by blohan View Post
And this relates to me how? I don't even live in the US or the UK, and I'm not a part of the industry, nor do I want to. I was simply pointing out two quacks selling snake oil in photography.
So then why do you care? If it's not your part of the industry, and not your part of the business, I would say that you don't have enough first-hand perspective to have an informed opinion. Everybody can make shit up. But that's all it is in the end then.

This is still meant to be a forum for professional exchange. And that assumes that everyone who participates has at least some level of first-hand knowledge of the subject. Maybe you know something about photography, but clearly you don't care nor do know much about the business of fashion photography.

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Originally Posted by blohan View Post
What you wrote is the perspective of a mediocre person. You are basically saying that, the charisma and the personality and physical style of a photographer is worth more than what they can actually do.
In commercial assignment photography both is equally important. If you want to be a purist and artist only, go shoot landscape.

Fashion photography is primarily a B2B and B2C transaction that sells a product or brand by the means of visual imagery (still & motion). It is driven by commerce, it is controlled by commerce. And yes, we use art in the process. But it is not done for the purpose of being artistic. And in the business world all those other considerations matter. If you don't like that, well, don't be part of it. But as you stated you aren't. You just enjoy being opinionated about something you don't really understand or care about.
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  #86  
Old 03-27-2015, 09:04 PM
Tom_Tom Tom_Tom is offline
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Re: Steven Klein, Mert and Marcus, all frauds.

Please remember that the behind the scenes shots are not necessarily taken with the actual camera and strobes so they can look strange and not very well lit (just ambient model lights with a behind sconces slr).

Also I've found that when taking images that will have a substantial amount of post production, it's best to shoot the scene a little flat that way the retouchers get the most info to play with. Sometimes the raw images look a little underwhelming but once you crank up the contrast with dodge and burn things come into place. It's a means to an end. On the other hand I find it much easier to calm down shine and highlights than to add them artificially later so maybe thats why some of the shots look a little shiny.


Also about the photographers you mention, it's a lot about connections, work history and business relationships to get into a position to shoot such a big name as Madonna. If the photographer can produce excellent end results thats all that really matters. The technical in-camera qualities can be debated but nothing will change as long as the end result is desirable. To say they are frauds just doesn't make sense, they are in high demand industry giants.

About small details, they might not have much time with her, say maybe 20min to get as many options as possible so if the hairline looks off, ahh just keep shooting because it will takes precious time for the hairstylist to fix it.
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  #87  
Old 03-28-2015, 03:44 PM
miloguy miloguy is offline
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Thumbs down Re: Steven Klein, Mert and Marcus, all frauds.

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Originally Posted by blohan View Post
You are embarrassing, not only do I know all of that, but I also know the relationship Madonna has with these quacks. They are friends and they can shoot her for as long as they want, she just doesn't know they are making her look this horrific, in fact, she doesn't even know these outtakes are out, she's that out of the loop, so stop bringing excuses for their quackness when you literally don't know anything about it.
Are you freaking kidding me? Madonna (who has been in the business for over 30 years) has no idea what her RAW images are turning out like? She has no control over what photo she is releasing to the public to attribute to her overall image? Please. You do realize she was getting her team to track down people who were releasing these outtakes not even two months ago?Why do you think she works with these people for her album covers and magazine spreads if she doesn't know what she is getting. That is why she is choosing these people, she knows they can deliver that image. Whether you think that is QUACK or not, you're entitled to your own opinion. However, you do not speak with any credibility in terms of commercial/editorial photography or post production as established in your various posts in this thread.

Get real, blohan. Bye.
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  #88  
Old 03-28-2015, 09:48 PM
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Aladdin Aladdin is offline
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Re: Steven Klein, Mert and Marcus, all frauds.

..........
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  #89  
Old 05-19-2015, 03:01 AM
cfritz cfritz is offline
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Re: Steven Klein, Mert and Marcus, all frauds.

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Originally Posted by blohan View Post
Sorry for the abrasive thread, I don't plan to stay here, I came across this board while looking for information on how to get the Vogue look, now I am not big on retouching, I like detail, realism and I try to get everything right on the shot. I'm not naive, I know retouching has been around since the first photographs were produced, but I don't like working unnecessarily, I cannot spend 2 days on a photograph, if you get it right on the shot, you don't have to.

I'm also a huge Madonna fan, and in the last few years a lot of outtakes have come out from her photoshoots were she frankly looks horrific. She has been mainly working with Steven Klein and Mert Alas and Marcus Piggot, and let me tell you, those guys are absolute frauds. They don't know how to shoot, period. You DO NOT ALLOW A SUBJECT TO WALK ON A SET LOOKING LIKE THIS:

http://41.media.tumblr.com/0ac6b4427...xb20o1_400.jpg

http://blowhan.tumblr.com/image/114262963658

http://41.media.tumblr.com/38a3316e2...b20o1_1280.jpg

bad makeup, badly fitted wig, dirty eyelashes, etc, etc, etc, the examples are all over the net and they are ungodly.

The saddest part is that, she truly does not look this way in real life, they make her look bad because they don't care, the poor retoucher will fix it later. By my calculation it would take almost an ENTIRE WEEK just to reconstruct the hairline and eliminate all the frizzy hair covering her face, and redoing her makeup and ironing her dress to get the picture to printing stage, which is what they did with her spread of w magazine 2009 which is where the pictures come from.

It's sad really, this guys are total frauds, someone else does the true work, they take the credit because they are "cool" meanwhile more talented artists may never get the chance because they are not cool people if you know what I mean.
Dude....simmer the F down. Wow. What's up with the rant? Instead of being a overall negative, unpleasant, know-it-all person, why don't you get the F off these forum and go take some pictures. Annoying as hell.
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  #90  
Old 05-19-2015, 07:30 AM
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Benny Profane Benny Profane is offline
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Re: Steven Klein, Mert and Marcus, all frauds.

I think he's banned. And behind locked doors. I hope.
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