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Race to the bottom and other misconceptions

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  #21  
Old 04-27-2015, 12:41 AM
skoobey skoobey is offline
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Re: Race to the bottom and other misconceptions

Different employment agencies, add sites and direct company adds. I'm just saying that business model may be flawed because the team is getting paid, but investors aren't. It's not like everyone is just working for free.
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  #22  
Old 04-27-2015, 12:49 AM
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Repairman Repairman is offline
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Re: Race to the bottom and other misconceptions

Even artists should work in a businesslike way. R&H's income didn't match their expenditure and the inevitable happened, which is not surprising, given the flaky open ended contracts they signed up to. With the amount of freelancers and short term contract workers working in the industry the VFX community will find it tough to force change in working practices.
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  #23  
Old 04-27-2015, 01:00 AM
skoobey skoobey is offline
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Re: Race to the bottom and other misconceptions

Bubble has to burst before things start improving. And if things really are as bad as they say, this is going to be soon. I guess either studios will hire artists themselves in the end.
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  #24  
Old 04-27-2015, 01:49 AM
klev klev is offline
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Re: Race to the bottom and other misconceptions

Quote:
Originally Posted by skoobey View Post
I guess either studios will hire artists themselves in the end.
That makes no sense. Things are brought in house when they become less complex to the point where doing so requires minimal risk. VFX has gone the opposite direction with enormous R&D costs and an increasing number of hours in render time. The studio is in fact mitigating their own risks. The long term survival of specific VFX shops is at best a tertiary concern for a given studio. I'm also not so sure about a bubble there. Salaries may vary, but if they're over the 6 figure mark, they're either amazing artists/engineers or it's a combination of strong ones + crazy hours.

You might also look into the cost of living in some of the bigger cities here. A small 1br flat will run you $1400 in the LA area or over $2k in a lot of the regions surrounding SF.

Edit : Edit: It may not be perfect, but Glassdoor is typically a more accurate source.
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  #25  
Old 04-27-2015, 02:10 AM
skoobey skoobey is offline
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Re: Race to the bottom and other misconceptions

Bubble being that so many companies fail at their business model that studios would have no choice but to organize artists themselves or invest into motion graphics studios.

Obviously there are A LOT of entry level positions, I wasn't looking at those. I think you're talking about way down the food chain. I doubt that a great visual artist would work for minimum wage at motion graphics house, when top add agencies pay 250K for someone like that.

I don't know I tend not to bitch as much as most people, so maybe my standards are off. 10-12 hour days one weekend in a couple of months is fine by me. Most people expect 8 hour days, weekends off and a month or more off for vacations, well I'm sorry, but then they have no right to complain.

Last edited by skoobey; 04-27-2015 at 02:20 AM.
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  #26  
Old 04-27-2015, 03:21 AM
klev klev is offline
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Re: Race to the bottom and other misconceptions

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Originally Posted by skoobey View Post
Bubble being that so many companies fail at their business model that studios would have no choice but to organize artists themselves or invest into motion graphics studios.

Obviously there are A LOT of entry level positions, I wasn't looking at those. I think you're talking about way down the food chain. I doubt that a great visual artist would work for minimum wage at motion graphics house, when top add agencies pay 250K for someone like that.
What gives you the impression that artists clear that amount? Your numbers are drastically inflated.

Quote:
Originally Posted by skoobey View Post
I don't know I tend not to bitch as much as most people, so maybe my standards are off. 10-12 hour days one weekend in a couple of months is fine by me. Most people expect 8 hour days, weekends off and a month or more off for vacations, well I'm sorry, but then they have no right to complain.
Some of the other creative fields have terrible working hours, at least according to people that have worked in them. A couple software engineers I knew that worked at (the same) video game studio mentioned the amount of times they slept at the office.
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  #27  
Old 04-27-2015, 03:31 AM
skoobey skoobey is offline
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Re: Race to the bottom and other misconceptions

Ok, so then I must be the luckiest guy in the world. I can't go into these discussions, there are so many levels, and I always wanted to climb as much as I could, obviously we are talking about different things. I am an artist, I work, there are people that work for me that earn much less then I do, but then they do really easy tasks and have a lot of free time.

My day:
Get up, check all the messengers and respond to the clients, then contact all the assistants.
Eat, exercise, take a shower, that kind of thing.
Work.
Lunch.
Work.
Again, daily chores.
Bed.

They had to sleep in their office? Boohoo, poor them, I feel so sorry for them. I sleep in my office every day.

Last edited by skoobey; 04-27-2015 at 03:36 AM.
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  #28  
Old 04-27-2015, 06:36 PM
klev klev is offline
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Re: Race to the bottom and other misconceptions

Quote:
Originally Posted by skoobey View Post

They had to sleep in their office? Boohoo, poor them, I feel so sorry for them. I sleep in my office every day.
I've done the same thing, but I don't see why you're emotionally attached to this to the point where you feel compelled to misrepresent several things so far. Your rates are off, and I would remind you that we were initially talking about the closure of a business not owned by any of those artists. The shop couldn't pay their bills, because they absorb a lot of the risk from the studios. It's a rather poor business model, but some of your followup statements (bringing things in house) were irrational there. That doesn't typically happen, because the business model is terrible.
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  #29  
Old 04-28-2015, 03:13 AM
skoobey skoobey is offline
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Re: Race to the bottom and other misconceptions

Because I'm tired of telling people over and over again. If you want to be really good, you need to practice practice practice and that mens hours. Only reason I've gotten so much better is because I practice like a mad person.

Their business model no longer works, time to find new one, but I highly doubt people are never getting paid, no ow would work if that were the case.
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