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Photo Retouching "Improving" photos, post-production, correction, etc.

High End Micro Dodge and Burn

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  #11  
Old 07-24-2015, 10:23 AM
skoobey skoobey is offline
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Re: High End Micro Dodge and Burn

Practice makes perfect. Klev, remember things I did couple of years back?

Just look at the images all the time, and analyze, V1972.

What none of these tutorials teach is why, for that you really need to study art(you don't need to go to college, but you do need to be involved in art one way or another).
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  #12  
Old 07-24-2015, 02:37 PM
klev klev is offline
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Re: High End Micro Dodge and Burn

Quote:
Originally Posted by skoobey View Post
Practice makes perfect. Klev, remember things I did couple of years back?
I remember. I think it was more than two years ago when you were really having trouble, and I strongly suspect you're better than me at it at this point. When I said I would probably do a video series if I had the right images, I meant one that actually talks about references and looks at some of that detail. It would be an enormous amount of work though.

What most of them do is walk through a relatively straightforward image after having done it once before. I don't think that's terribly interesting. Their original pass should at least be shown either in cuts or at higher speed to gain some perspective for what they thought about, what changed their mind, etc. The issue as you mention is often one of judgement. I've commented many times on how to fix mechanical issues, and they are the same way I went about testing my own skill on the mechanical stuff.
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  #13  
Old 08-08-2015, 12:56 AM
Bettelyoun Bettelyoun is offline
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Re: High End Micro Dodge and Burn

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Originally Posted by klev View Post
Here's one from a guy that used to post on here. He charges quite a bit for access, and I'm sure it's an attempt to cover his time and recover any costs on something with a limited market. You can read the headings without purchasing the series, and you should note that he refers to a lot of the same stuff that I discussed in earlier posts (a year or more ago).

If I had access to some images that I really liked with permission to do whatever I want and post them, I would probably make one that includes coverage of reference material and some reasoning on how to avoid flattening muscle and bone aspects of the face.

No one ever talks about stuff like that, and they never mention things like how to test your drawing accuracy. It can alleviate a lot of frustration if you're able to ensure that things always behave as expected.
I have the videos from Conrad and they ain't worth $200. You can learn more from a speed process retouch from YouTube.
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  #14  
Old 08-08-2015, 12:21 PM
klev klev is offline
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Re: High End Micro Dodge and Burn

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Originally Posted by Bettelyoun View Post
I have the videos from Conrad and they ain't worth $200. You can learn more from a speed process retouch from YouTube.
I figured as much. I should have been more clear on the point about covering his time. Things like tutorial videos are not a viable source of income with the possible exception of something like lynda.com, and even then I'm not sure what they pay. I don't personally think that concepts like burn and dodge work are that interesting on their own, given that they're a small fraction of what needs to be learned. I must have drifted somewhat when writing that post, because I remember including that to show that that the headings really describe some mundane stuff.

The other reason was to show that there aren't any real trade secrets here. I've commented a bunch of times how various things could have been achieved in any given image.
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  #15  
Old 08-08-2015, 01:04 PM
skoobey skoobey is offline
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Re: High End Micro Dodge and Burn

There are a couple of reoccurring issues IMO.

1. Delusion that Photoshop does things for you and that you haven't found the right option or technique. Only one program can do that - Human Brain Program, Photoshop is just a tool. Everything is done manually, there are smarter ways to do things now that it's digital, but image is still a labour of love.

2. Thinking that learning the tools will make you an artist. Anyone that wants to replicate some file first must realize what is it that they like about the original.

3. Lack of dedication. Noone became good at anything over night.
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  #16  
Old 11-25-2015, 06:43 PM
postrophe postrophe is offline
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Re: High End Micro Dodge and Burn

Hi

Well said "Skoobey". ;-)
Pierre
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  #17  
Old 12-25-2015, 03:07 PM
Jaalpari Jaalpari is offline
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Re: High End Micro Dodge and Burn

Dnb needs time. It comes in time. All we need to make sure we use right visual for micro dnb and know exactly when to stop.
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  #18  
Old 01-19-2017, 07:20 PM
topazdan topazdan is offline
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Re: High End Micro Dodge and Burn

V1972, I have also been on a search for tutorials on high-end level D&B. That is, what is it that professional retouchers do to a photo with D&B that amateurs do not? I have seen some examples where the brush is made to about the pore level and there is micro application there at 10% (+/-) but I cannot see what the artist is seeking to accomplish.

There appear to be a few videos on Youtube that show quite nice results but most have no voice-over instruction (just annoying music).

The link that klev posted above no longer works.

I would like to know if there is a link or another thread to assist. Thanks for your help
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  #19  
Old 01-19-2017, 08:15 PM
skoobey skoobey is offline
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Re: High End Micro Dodge and Burn

If you know how to draw, and if you know what needs to be drawn, you're there. I use only a simple round brush with varying hardness, opacity, flow, jitter, transfer etc.
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  #20  
Old 01-20-2017, 04:23 AM
klev klev is offline
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Re: High End Micro Dodge and Burn

Quote:
Originally Posted by topazdan View Post
V1972, I have also been on a search for tutorials on high-end level D&B. That is, what is it that professional retouchers do to a photo with D&B that amateurs do not? I have seen some examples where the brush is made to about the pore level and there is micro application there at 10% (+/-) but I cannot see what the artist is seeking to accomplish.
Understanding the mechanics there won't help much. I have commented on this somewhat in the past. I think it's possible for many amateurs/enthusiasts/beginners to derive a lot of improvement from a combination of better judgement and overall accuracy.

There are sanity checks available for both. You can use things like anatomical references to check your judgement much of the time. You can draw simple shapes to gauge your accuracy, specifically your ability to paint smooth strokes that start and end in the desired manner. Learning to mask really really well also goes a long ways.

I guess I don't think that people seem to benefit that much from copying tutorials. Things like that help when you're completely lost and searching for a direction. Even then I'm not sure they always accomplish the desired effect.

Worrying about pore level detail isn't that big of a deal. I suspect you can already handle that.
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