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new db technique

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  #1  
Old 01-16-2016, 02:33 PM
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marameo marameo is offline
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new db technique

Hi,

I normally dodge and burn on two masked curve layers with the brush set at 5% opacity and 0% hardness. I have heard that one can dodge and burn between low pass and high pass layers by eye dropping a color on the skin.

How is that possible? Can it actually be done?

Thanks
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Old 01-16-2016, 05:43 PM
klev klev is offline
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Re: new db technique

You mentioned 0% hardness and always the same opacity. This could turn out to be a complete mess or it might work okay. I would suggest that you vary opacity as necessary, because if you have to go over precisely the same small area repeatedly, you will have more unintended results.

In early versions of photoshop you either had 0% hardness or 100%. This means you had to make your own in betweens. If you're working with 0% all the time, do you vary brush size at all? I would have to choose a low enough opacity to use several passes of decreasing size on many details if I did it that way. 5% seems a bit high for this, so I suspect you don't do that.

Regarding the eyedropper, I've done something similar without ever using frequency separation. I never use it, so I can't help you there.

Anyway you can only consider these things for local adjustments.

Example : Toning down skin highlights

Select eyedrop tool. I usually use a 3x3 setting

Save a sample of the skin highlight

Save a sample of skin near the highlight, which represents the desired color

Create a new curves layer

Use the curves adjustment layer menu to select only the red channel in your curves layer

Drag a point starting from the red coordinate of the highlight sample to the red coordinate value of the "good" skin sample.

Repeat with green and blue channels.


If any of these generate curves adjustments that look too steep, choose points that are closer together in value. If the color balance looks off when you apply this layer to highlight sections, adjust the point in the appropriate channel. It may take a little practice. Try it. If you have trouble, post a response with any followup questions.
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Old 01-16-2016, 06:52 PM
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marameo marameo is offline
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Re: new db technique

It should be 0% hardness, 100% opacity and 5% flow, when it comes to the brush tool. Yet, it won't work. Could it be that it only works with the tablet instead of the mouse?

Between the low and hi pass layers I add one white filled layer (DODGE) and a black filled layer (BURN) both with a black mask. I start using the brush set as above and I see white and black lines! What is wrong with that?
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Old 01-16-2016, 07:54 PM
klev klev is offline
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Re: new db technique

Quote:
Originally Posted by marameo View Post
It should be 0% hardness, 100% opacity and 5% flow, when it comes to the brush tool. Yet, it won't work. Could it be that it only works with the tablet instead of the mouse?

Between the low and hi pass layers I add one white filled layer (DODGE) and a black filled layer (BURN) both with a black mask. I start using the brush set as above and I see white and black lines! What is wrong with that?

This strategy is useless. If you think someone else made it work, you should request a psd file from them to see what they did differently. I can go into great detail regarding the problems, but no one would find it interesting.

From my perspective

1. Luminance blending is ugly.
2. It applies the same offset to all pixels across every bit of data, which looks
even worse with a non-linear color space.

I also think your brush settings are going to make your life more difficult. I know I couldn't control anything if I used that as my default brush without any changes at any time.
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Old 01-17-2016, 03:43 AM
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Re: new db technique

https://youtu.be/ZeEXY2kIpVo?t=19m18s

It is technique number 4 I wonder why it won't work to me.

I think I shoud get back to dodge and burn on two seperate masked curve layers.
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Old 01-17-2016, 10:33 AM
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Re: new db technique

So, this is what my layers palette looks like:

http://41.media.tumblr.com/bb82f9d54...o348o1_400.png

I was wondering if I should move the d&b into the freq sep folder or leave it standalone.
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Old 01-17-2016, 12:38 PM
skoobey skoobey is offline
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Re: new db technique

Than it is painting, not DNB. DNB=shading.

Yes, you can, and it's not a sin as many would suggest, but just as with dnb you need to know what you want before you start the work. Try to avoid the easy trap of making everything smooth, so that the skin texture looks like it's floating on top of the image.
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Old 01-17-2016, 02:26 PM
klev klev is offline
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Re: new db technique

Quote:
Originally Posted by marameo View Post
https://youtu.be/ZeEXY2kIpVo?t=19m18s

It is technique number 4 I wonder why it won't work to me.

I think I shoud get back to dodge and burn on two seperate masked curve layers.
I want to clarify that I think that is a very bad idea. He relies on a constant offset where I would only consider translations that apply some kind of scale factor to the data.


His method applies a constant offset, so you replace the original coordinates (r,g,b) = (base+detail,base+detail,base+detail) with

( a*fill + (1-a)*base + detail, a*fill + (1-a)*base + detail, a*fill + (1-a)*base + detail)

where 'a' is approximately equal to the value of your layer mask divided by 255. Note that if your layer mask is 255 (pure white), this equation is now

(fill + detail, fill + detail, fill + detail)

but if fill is much brighter or darker than the original base, a*fill can grow very quickly relative to (1-a)*base, so you converge very quickly toward a constant value instead of a smooth component.

If you don't understand this it's fine. The guy making the video also doesn't understand it. He just knows that the results work for him, which is fine.

The method I suggested applies a scale factor based on the original value, which should be more stable. I haven't tried it with the frequency separation approach. It should work assuming that you sample appropriately. If it just shows white and black in your swatches, you had an alpha channel selected at the time or accidentally hit 'x'.
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Old 01-17-2016, 03:50 PM
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Re: new db technique

Quote:
Originally Posted by skoobey View Post
Try to avoid the easy trap of making everything smooth, so that the skin texture looks like it's floating on top of the image.
Do you mean I'd better local D&B in tiny dots and lines instead of doing freq sep (lasso tool and blur)?
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Old 01-17-2016, 04:01 PM
skoobey skoobey is offline
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Re: new db technique

Exactly what I thought. You don't go selecting an entire area on low pass and blur it. That gives you a sort of flat area, but it is definitely not a precision tool.

Simple. You paint(no freq sep) when you need to override something that is present in the image. You dnb when you want to shift tones but preserve detail that's already there.

So you paint in lashes, because you are overriding skin texture, but you dnb skin because you want to keep the detail.

Freq separation is useful when replacing portions of texture and then you go to the low layer and make it blend by painting, but you don't really do this instead of DNB(you can use it to smooth out knee caps and wrinkles in clothes for example, but not for detailed work).
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