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The Photoshop CS Rip-off

 
 
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  #11  
Old 09-03-2005, 08:32 PM
tom langford tom langford is offline
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Hi Swampy,

I'm no expert on pre-press, but if you go to Print > Show more options > Output you will find options for setting the bleed, corner crops, etc.

Hope this helps,

Tom.
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  #12  
Old 09-04-2005, 08:53 AM
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Swampy Swampy is offline
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Tom, I'm aware of those options in the print (with priview) dialog box. I was addressing the need to set up the document on screen to match the output. For example, a magazine may give me specs for a 5x7 ad plus 1/8 inch bleeds. They may also specify that all elements must be set inside a 1/4 inch margin of the 5x7 size.

This means I must create a new document 5.25 x 7..25 for the bleeds, then within the new document draw out guides to define the 1/8 bleed areas on screen and I usually also draw out guides to define the 1/4 set off margin inside the bleeds (or sometimes just to define the 3/8 total margin).

This is all so easy to set up in InDesign.
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  #13  
Old 09-04-2005, 09:05 AM
Mike Mike is offline
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Tom

I quote "There were only two things that I could see being of use to me: support for raw files (for some reason all the rage now with photographers), and a more advanced transform feature."

Do I understand that you have some problems with shooting in RAW?

Would you like to share those concerns?

Mike
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  #14  
Old 09-04-2005, 07:51 PM
tom langford tom langford is offline
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Mike,

For me the value of shooting in Raw is that you could perform all basic image editing afterwards to maintain the highest quality file possible. You could then convert to Tiff, or whatever the client specifies. I believe some Raw formats can also hold greater highlight detail. My clients usually specify 300ppi Tiffs or high-quality 300ppi Jpegs, and I shoot accordingly.

My own digital camera is a bit old and does not record Raw files, but I see my work in print every week and quality has never been an issue.

I have seen some photographers do is shoot in Raw and then simply convert to Tiff without ever using the advantages that Raw has to offer. They did not mention anything about quality (or colour temperature) being the reason, and would not have the time to use the advantages Raw has to offer, anyway.

I have only met one photographer, so far, who shoots in Raw because he has a client who specifies it.

Tom.
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  #15  
Old 09-04-2005, 07:55 PM
tom langford tom langford is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Swampy
Tom, I'm aware of those options in the print (with priview) dialog box. I was addressing the need to set up the document on screen to match the output. For example, a magazine may give me specs for a 5x7 ad plus 1/8 inch bleeds. They may also specify that all elements must be set inside a 1/4 inch margin of the 5x7 size.

This means I must create a new document 5.25 x 7..25 for the bleeds, then within the new document draw out guides to define the 1/8 bleed areas on screen and I usually also draw out guides to define the 1/4 set off margin inside the bleeds (or sometimes just to define the 3/8 total margin).

This is all so easy to set up in InDesign.
Swampy,

Sorry, now I understand what you mean. Since Photoshop is important for pre-press, it is a bit mean of Adobe to omit a bleed function. It would hardly threaten the sales of InDesign.

Speaking of guides, I would find it a great help to be able to set up guides at any angle. I didn't find this feature in CS2, but it would be a nice surprise if it were there.

Tom.
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  #16  
Old 09-05-2005, 10:47 AM
Mike Mike is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tom langford
Mike,

For me the value of shooting in Raw is that you could perform all basic image editing afterwards to maintain the highest quality file possible. You could then convert to Tiff, or whatever the client specifies. I believe some Raw formats can also hold greater highlight detail. My clients usually specify 300ppi Tiffs or high-quality 300ppi Jpegs, and I shoot accordingly.

My own digital camera is a bit old and does not record Raw files, but I see my work in print every week and quality has never been an issue.

I have seen some photographers do is shoot in Raw and then simply convert to Tiff without ever using the advantages that Raw has to offer. They did not mention anything about quality (or colour temperature) being the reason, and would not have the time to use the advantages Raw has to offer, anyway.

I have only met one photographer, so far, who shoots in Raw because he has a client who specifies it.

Tom.
OK, now I see where you are going. I shoot mostly people, and RAW is a very handy tool for me. However if one has the technical ability (and some times the the time) to do the job correctly then RAW would not be necessary.

I have never had a customer request that I shoot in RAW, I would think that it would never happen because the reason I am being hired is because I have the ability to do the job and they do not. Trying to explain it to them is just way more information that they need, I just want them to write the check!

Thanks for the reply

Mike
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  #17  
Old 09-06-2005, 11:35 PM
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Photo678 Photo678 is offline
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photoshop is NOT a jack of all trades...it is not a DTP tool...if you need bleeds, use something for that job, like indesign, or quark. That's like saying, "why can't i html code in paint".


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  #18  
Old 09-07-2005, 04:43 AM
tom langford tom langford is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike
I have never had a customer request that I shoot in RAW, I would think that it would never happen because the reason I am being hired is because I have the ability to do the job and they do not. Trying to explain it to them is just way more information that they need, I just want them to write the check!

Thanks for the reply

Mike,
Yes, I'm with you all the way: I do the job, they write the cheque - a perfect combination of talents!

Tom.
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  #19  
Old 09-07-2005, 08:38 AM
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Swampy Swampy is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Photo678
photoshop is NOT a jack of all trades...it is not a DTP tool...if you need bleeds, use something for that job, like indesign, or quark. That's like saying, "why can't i html code in paint".


I beg to differ. Apparently you dont actually work in the prepress trades. If you did you would know that PhotoShop is a basic tool for preparing photos for inclusion in books, brochures, print ads and other printed materials. Color correction, cropping, sharpening, masking etc. are all done in Photoshop prior to placement in a page layout program.

I recently did a full page ad that called for 1/2 inch bleed at the left margin and a 1/8 bleed on the other three sides with all text and other graphic elements to fall within 1/4 inch of the inside bleed margins. It would have been very helpful if Photoshop could show me the full size document on screen with the bleed areas defined in a color of my choice. It can get very confusing when you have to do the math to draw out guides to match the parameters. Converting fractions to decimals can result in errors.

If you think Photoshop's relationship to DTP programs is just scan, crop and plunk the result into Quark or InDesign it's obvious you don't do high end DTP.
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  #20  
Old 09-07-2005, 03:51 PM
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Photo678 Photo678 is offline
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nope, have to disagree with you...photoshop/illustrator to indesign...plop your psd's or eps files right into indesign...set your bleeds in there...you can set your ink flow...spot colors...plus its got that nifty preflight, packaging tool, as opposed to running around and making sure you have collected all of your fonts, all of your files, etc etc.

As I said, it is ridiculously clunky to do layouts for press in photoshop...

You shouldn't need to draw out your bleeds in photoshop...make your corrections in photoshop, and position according to bleeds in Indesign.

You are kind of contradicting yourself, unless i misunderstand you. You want to put bleeds and slugs on the photo, prior to putting it in the layout?


But no, I have never done high end design or anything like that

Last edited by Photo678; 09-07-2005 at 04:02 PM.
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