Dave Hill "Shows" his layering - Quite the show!

[Vernon]

Adventure Series Exposed

...it's amazing what a little After Effects can do to add the extra dimension to one's Photoshop stuffs!

[lkroll]

Very cool presentation. Thanks for sharing the link to it Vernon.

[mushmush]

Yeah, thanks for posting the link.

[Boneappetit]

That video is so cool! Now I can see clearly that DH's imagination to make a composition is great... Thanx for the link Vernon.

[Vernon]

Glad to share it - Mr. Hill's web site has the video in his "Behind The Scenes" section.

From what I've seen of his works, the man doesn't just "layer" his shots, he creates very ingenious composites, tying in the various shots he takes.

[kav]

This was a fun watch but I don't think his layering structure is what makes his work cool. Almost all of the composite elements were what I expected them to be. There is some obvious work involved matching lighting and tones between the shots and it takes some time. That isn't what makes it cool though. It's more about the design/concept and the process. I'm sure at least some of the people on this board could recreate any of those images from an fpo + the image files used to make them, but that's more about technical aptitude for matching a request. The design/concept/shooting process is makes these special.

[skydog]

Look at all the other video's on the right. It really gives you an idea the equipment, time and people to put together these shots. Then think about the Dave Hill link and many are looking for a filter or a few photoshop techniques. Dave has an entire team....not just individuals who move equipment but probably specialists in lighting, photoshop etc. Look at his lighting...the number of lights per shoot...the size. Hell think of the money invested in just the stands. So where did Dave learn his craft especially so early in life? I'm sure a lot is trial and error until he has perfected his look.

[RobertAsh]

Originally Posted by kav

This was a fun watch but I don't think his layering structure is what makes his work cool. Almost all of the composite elements were what I expected them to be. There is some obvious work involved matching lighting and tones between the shots and it takes some time. That isn't what makes it cool though. It's more about the design/concept and the process. I'm sure at least some of the people on this board could recreate any of those images from an fpo + the image files used to make them, but that's more about technical aptitude for matching a request. The design/concept/shooting process is makes these special.

It's actually all of these things, not just one or the other. Plus more.


There is a thread here called Demystifying Dave Hill that:

• has been ongoing since April 2006
• has 2,500 responses
• has 325,000 views

Even so, no one even here has quite figured out how Dave Hill does it. This composite portion is only one element of his complex process -- but it's a vital one. Every element is vital, every element is what makes it look cool.

It's like a former chairman of Toyota once said in a quote I read:

• Excellence is not so much doing one thing 100% better as it is doing 100 things 1% better.

Whether or not that quote is original to him, he certainly used it to make the correct point. Every one of those '100 things' is what makes the excellent end result so excellent.

[skydog]

Thread started June 2007

[Jason Dulin]

I came here to say mostly what Kav said previously. What makes his work unique is it's production value. He indeed has a team of talented individuals and wouldn't be able to accomplish these images without them. I imaging there is a ton of pre-visualization that goes into his work. And yes these are huge jobs, meaning there is a ton of money. Being able to scout locations all over the world has to help. Plus if you are doing an unrelated shoot and have an assistant you can tell to "go shoot all the stock you can at this location" - I imagine he has a massive collection of his own stock that he can pull from.

And from a photographer's standpoint, You have to look at how he lights. I know people don't want to hear this, but images like this have to start with good light. You are going to have a tough time getting a similar look from an image shot with one light.

All that aside, I think it's great that Dave Hill is open enough to show an exploded view of his layers like this. I think that this is more telling in regard to retouching technique than guessing at his workflow. For me what sells it is how well balanced each element is in relation to the others.

www.HeavyTheory.com

[kav]

Regarding the size of his team, that's pretty normal for a successful photographer in a major market. Several assistants, makeup, hair, wardrobe (might also be in charge of props). Some of these people also have their own assistants. You might have a digital tech too. I can recall a few photographers who swore by the work of a particular lighting guy here but most of the time their first assistant seems to deal with that. That stuff is normal in terms of production.

I still think some insight on the planning/conceptualization phase would be a fun watch. I took a look at a few of the videos and you can tell he's shooting certain elements to fit into a comp, or perhaps to a few variations on a comp. With how specific they're being they must have some process for concept artwork and he has to have some way of coming up with this plan. I mean some of the background stuff could be figured out toward the end, but most of that has to be planned out. I'm also wondering if the concept artwork is coming from the ad agency side or the photographer end on most of these. The photoshop is something I can mostly dissect on a personal level so I'm not so enthralled by it.

[Flashtones]

I expected to see his PS Layers Pallet. This was much better. Phenomenal presentation, really.

Interesting to see how much atmospheric schmutz he overlays over his subjects.

[RobertAsh]

Originally Posted by skydog

Thread started June 2007

Thanks for the correction. Turns out I was citing the join date of the person who started the thread, not the start date of the thread itself

The point, of course, is that saying the photoshop is not important or the compositing is dissectable is missing the point. The point is that all of those factors, both dissectable and mysterious, have to work together or the whole thing doesn't work right. All of the greats in any field always pay closest attention to the basic things that others take for granted. That is one of the key things that sets them apart.

Not to say the conceptual stuff is unimportant, quite the contrary. But executing the fundamentals consistently flawlessly is the foundation for everything else built on top of that, we shouldn't minimize those things.

[kav]

*sigh* I'm not missing the point. The layering isn't anything new. Advertisements for television and film use this kind of composite work too. The storytelling in his images make them great and even if the person doing the photoshop work changed from one shoot to the next, the work would still be amazing assuming a talented retoucher who understands the style.

I wish he'd talk more about his process. I'd find it interesting hearing how he views things from start to finish. It was already obvious looking at them where he fit what together for the most part. The thing that still made it an enjoyable was that he made quite a presentation out of it with the use of depth to separate elements rather than simply showing a layer stack in photoshop.

[RobertAsh]

Ok, fair enough This strikes me as a glass half-empty, glass half-full discussion and your points are certainly valid and reasonable. Cheers!

[shanegoldberg]

Dave has a good video on his site: http://davehillphoto.tumblr.com/ about his processes and his methodology etc. really cool video.

[Boneappetit]

Until now, I was thinking that Dave Hill was another guy. I don't know how old the video is, but I've seen another guy who's name is Dave Hill, working in Hollywood, doing interviews and stuff like that... I wonder if it's the same guy, older by now...

[Nasturtium]

Originally Posted by shanegoldberg

Dave has a good video on his site: http://davehillphoto.tumblr.com/ about his processes and his methodology etc. really cool video.

Thanks! That was neat. It gave me LOTS of ideas. Loved his drawings ;-)