RetouchPRO Sponsorship (trial balloon)

[Doug Nelson]

This is an idea I've been toying with for some time, but I've been hesitant to put in action (fear of backfiring, etc.).

Here's the idea:
Instead of donations, there would be an annual sponsorship fee. This would not be a donation (though it would still pay for the things donations do now), since you'd get something in return.

Some things I'm considering in return for sponsorship:

• "Sponsor" would become a new user title
• Higher upload limit in the Member Gallery
• Participation in new monthly contests

This last item would be probably the biggest departure for RP. It would be a for-real monthly contest with an actual declared "Winner". This is less trivial than it might sound, since "Winner of the RetouchPRO February 2005 Restoration Contest" could go some way towards building a reputation. It could be used on your website or resume.

As yet undetermined:

• How much per year this would cost (though it is already certain that there cannot be different "levels" of sponsorship)
• How much additional Member Gallery space would be made available
• Other features and/or priveledges

One thing that I have decided is (if this gets launched at all) that nothing (repeat, NOTHING) that is currently available would be changed for anyone, including non-sponsor members.

Please give your comments, feedback, suggestions, yea, nay, etc. I'd need to be confident of at least 20-30 sponsorships out of the gate to even consider this. How much would this be worth? How much Gallery space would be fair? What other items might be useful? Do you think "RetouchPRO Contest Winner" would help get you business?

[Xaran]

I like the idea of a fixed fee - with donations I am always left wondering if I gave enough. As for the gallery space - more is a definite vote getter 5Mb or even 10Mb would be about right in my opinion.

I'd be ok with whatever you decide for the fee, I'm sure you would fix a fair price.

Christine

[Ed_L]

Originally Posted by Doug Nelson

Some things I'm considering in return for sponsorship:

• "Sponsor" would become a new user title
• Higher upload limit in the Member Gallery
• Participation in new monthly contests

Here's my two pennies:
None of the things listed would make me become a sponsor. Don't get me wrong....I've been a supporter of this site since it's earliest days, and I expect to continue to be. Surely this site has been a goldmine for many people. I wonder if it might be an option to give new people a free trial period of a week or two, then they must make a contribution if they want to continue using the site. I think you would probably pull in more $ if everyone gave a small amount rather than having 20 -30 sponsors at a higher per member donation. "Sponsorship" kind of scares me because some of us are more able (or willing) to give larger amounts, but required donations (any amount), at certain intervals might appear more appealing to many. I know part of my meager donations go to provide things for the "artistic side", which doesn't really interest me. But that's OK with me. If you do opt for sponsorship, would it still be appropriate to have periodic donation threads? I think the answer to this is yes, but you'll have to make that decision.

Ed

[kiska]

A sponsorship type fee is reasonable, i think. It was stated that what is now available would continue to be so. NAPP charges $99/year, which includes a magazine every two months and various discounts. Hopefully, a fee would be something less than this.
However, this could lead to a 'class system' of sorts in some people's minds. Sponsors might feel a bit privileged and others perhaps a bit intimidated.
Lots to think about.
kiska
BTW, This 'Senior' member business kinda rubs me the wrong way. This ain't the AARP, is it???

[Ed_L]

Originally Posted by kiska

BTW, This 'Senior' member business kinda rubs me the wrong way. This ain't the AARP, is it???

In my case, it isn't far from that.

Doug,
I seem to remember something being said about the bills coming due again in June. Is this right? If so, maybe we should start another fund raising campaign to tide us over until you can make up your mind how the future will look. Let us know if we need to get one going now. This *is* June!

Ed

[W. Rose]

Doug,
I am retired and have been using this site for some time now, and like someone else mentioned, it is a gold mine for me also. I feel badly that i have not contributed. But i do intend to start doing my share and whatever you deside will be fine with me. Because of all of the wonderful people here it has enriched my daily living. I would like to mention all of the names but they are to numerous. A few that have helped me directly, Flora and Vikky, thank you so very much and you Doug for giving us something that is so worthwhile to continued. I hope i haven't talked to much here.
You can expect my contribution in a couple of weeks when i get my retirement check and then each month thereafter.
And God Bless All of you members
Wayne

[DannyRaphael]

Kiska: Get over it. You're just having a "senior moment."

- - - - -

Doug:

While a little competition can be motivator to improve skills (and try a little harder), one limitation of a monthly event is only 12 winners/year. Good for the winners, potentially discouraging for other participants.

To supplement this activity consider developing/offering a RetouchPRO Certification of some sort, where sponsored members would be eligible to complete (at their own pace) a number of non-trivial exercises demonstrating mastery of various "pro" techniques. Perhaps the basis of the exercises could ones contained in the Restoration and Retouching book. If you think about it, if one masters all the skills in that book, that would be saying something.

Have exercise results critiqued by qualified/respected folks such as yourself, Flora, Jak, Vikki, etc. Not a rubberstamp approval type of thing. Be tough. If a submitted exercise is high quality, then onto the next one. If quality is insufficient, return it with some pointers and the member can try again until he gets it right.

Have a special thread that only Doug can update, where member names, dates of certification are posted as "proof" of completion.

I'm rambling again... What else is new?

~Danny~

[Ed_L]

Keep rambling, Danny. Excellent idea!

Ed

[Jeff L]

I made a New Years resolution that I would not ever again donate to another internet photo site.

While reading this thread it came to me that this isn't your run of the mill photo site. I know....understatement of the year, but it is true. I have learned quite a bit from this site since I wandered in. That is more than I can say about any of the sites I donated to.

This site is a goldmine of information and in my opinion, one of the best. If there is anything I could do to help keep the site running smoothly I wouldn't hesitate.
The idea of going through the Retouch & Restoration book is a great idea! I just have to get off my butt and get the new edition

As far as extra gallery space goes. I have my own space for that and update it on a regular basis, so that doesn't affect me as a citizen. And when I really think about it...you really wouldn't have to add anything to entice me to help out.

This site is worth it.

[Doug Nelson]

The server bill for next year is eminent, which is the reason I posted this now. I didn't want people to donate if this plan is launched.

The idea of the contests is not to improve skills, that is served well enough by the Challenges. The idea is to have something concrete to help those trying to earn money (remember, this isn't RetouchAM). And yes, to attract more highest-level users. And contests more frequent than monthly would be worthless, although there could be multiple types of contests, just as there are multiple Challenges. Again, it's for the professional members, and if winners are common there is no value to being a winner.

As for certification, that's been on my mind since before I started RP, but I detest bogus certifications, and have yet to figure a way where I personally could certify someone I've never seen in person. I'm not going to risk my own reputation vouching for the skills of someone that could be submitting someone else's work.

The primary reasoning behind the sponsorship is that it would be a way for those that make money off RP to pay the expenses of RP. So I'm fine with non-professionals not seeing any reason to sponsor.

[Andrew]

I'm open to any suggestions! Each time I visit this site I wonder why I don't enter more often. I suspect its because I'm either retouching photos or goofing off. This place has been a valuable resource for me when I run across something that I've forgotten how to do or never knew in the first place. Would I take advantage of a contest? I like the idea but hoo nose.

I would support any reasonable moolah asked for!

I suspect it would take me some years to win a contest after seeing the splendid work around here but then again I'm my own worst critic. Photoshop has been my passion since I discovered it. Seldom a day goes by that I wonder how I ever used an air brush!

Blah blah. blah .. Another geezer rambles!

Andrew

[winwintoo]

I see that I'm listed as a "senior" member - I'm old and I've been around a long time, but don't look to me as an expert!

I found RetouchPRO soon after it launched and soon after I started using PhotoShop. I made some friends here and learned enough about PhotoShop to make it very interesting for me, I know enough about it to use it in many ways, but what I know is a drop in the bucket compared to what there is to know.

I read the new posts on this forum daily as a way of keeping in touch and have posted enough that the vBulletin software has bumped me to *senior* status. When I need help with a restoration, or inspiration, I know where to look. This is without a doubt the best community of Photo professionals and amateurs on the web.

Doug is to be commended for allowing RetouchPRO to grow into what the community wants it to be while quietly guiding it along and never imposing his will on the majority. The bills do need to be paid though and sponsorship would be one way of getting that done.

If it is decided that sponsorship is the way to go, count me in. But, there needs to be a way to designate me as a batboy, and people like Flora (and others too numerous to mention) as MVPs.

Margaret

[DannyRaphael]

Margaret:

Wouldn't you prefer to be a batgirl over a batboy?

I share your feelings about Doug's steady, but not heavy-handed, guidance, the site in general, our membership and the personnal commitment to support it no matter what Doug decides.

~Danny~

[winwintoo]

Originally Posted by DannyRaphael

Margaret:

Wouldn't you prefer to be a batgirl over a batboy?

~Danny~

Maybe I've reached a stage in life where gender no longer matters

Margaret

[jch71566]

Doug,

I think that I would support the site with a reasonable yearly sponsorship.

I would like to touch further on Danny's certification idea, though. I understand your concerns with bogus certifications and the anonymity of the web-medium. However, instead of a certification of completion of some course material, perhaps you could expand on the monthly challenge winner idea.

Certainly you could, and probably should, announce the winner -- this is a very special credential. However, the remainder of the entrys should be eligible for something. Perhaps you could use a star system: JCH71566 is ranked as a 4-star photo-art contestant at RetouchPRO. Perhaps you could give a certificate of completion for participating -AND- meeting the criteria of the contest: JCH71566 has successfully completed 7 manipulation contests at RetouchPRO.

I dunno, but I think the idea deserves some thought.

-Jeff