[zganie]

Look people/companies are looking for original talent not knockoffs if they want someone elses work they will hire them
Zganie

[jagerman]

Huh? Where did that come from?

[Benny Profane]

left field?


Mars?


Montreal?

[zganie]

Where did it come from? Maybe the 500plus posts i saw on dave hill style
or people constantly asking how to duplicate another retouchers work

[Benny Profane]

Oh yeah, hey, I'm with you on that one. Nearly 74,000 hits, too. Popular look.

[Sweetlight]

Easy now.....

I too agree that the plethora of "Dave Hill" how-to requests have been astronomical but let's remember. There is NOTHING new under the sun and it is gonna be one of those eager to learn people, a kid probably that finds just the right click of a button or twist on the theme that pushes it above and beyond it's birthplace. Let's never chastise those who are eager to learn no matter how worn out it is or how tired we are of seeing the question. I know they could easily do a forum search and find more information than they could ever fit into the human brain but just the fact that they want to learn, in this easy as pie, digital, shoot and chimp world is a sign that there is some hope for the art at least and enough of that and maybe I can one day NEVER IN MY LIFE hear again that phrase, "It's digital now and anyone can be a photographer." I'd like to smack 'em up side the head because that my friends is the true ignorance in this matter. Now hand one of those digital, auto-focus, auto exposure, face recognition sensing, shoot a hundred images till one looks like it may be okay because you say what looks like an in focus, nicely lit and composed image by looking at it on a 1-inch by 1.5-inch LCD screen. Hand one of those chimps a camera and make 'em shoot a shuttle launch or a race car at 200-mph, having to pan, manual focus and actually make an exposure because you can look at the light and know what to shoot at, hand them one of those and you will see the cream rise to the top and the dregs at the bottom of the barrel.
Sorry, had to get that one off my chest.

Nice talking to yall,

c

[jagerman]

It is nothing to get upset about. The Hill and Fiscus looks are the trend right now. Some people just like to follow the crowd instead leading it. But it is ok. Take it easy man.

[Sweetlight]

Jagerman,
I am not sure if it was me you were telling to take it easy but if so I am sorry if it came across as well..... cross. I truly was saying the same as you. Everyone needs to find their own way. I find much more hope in the fact that at least they want to learn something badly enough to ask than to just "spray and pray" firing bursts of images hoping to get at least one that is halfway suitable. By learning a new method I feel they at least have a starting point to possibly improve upon or come up with the "next best greatest technique". As a part-time instructor it's hard enough just to get most of them to show some interest in the field of study that they themselves have chosen so I don't care if they ask me a hundred times how Warhol shot his soup can so successfully, I'll more than gladly try my dambdest to explain it a hundred times. In our digital world it is so hard to become spoiled and lazy because of the ease of the process in comparison to film. And once they find that lazy streak they then very often fail to find their creative soul if in fact they have one, mostly because they are under the misconception that it's as easy as point and shoot and the art of seeing light, composing elements within the frame and making an image that not only speaks out loud your ideas but encourages others to interpret the images with their own life experiences adding subtle nuances to the work before them. I did not mean to come off as arrogant or belligerent, I was just trying to say let's never cease to encourage those who in this brave new world have the courage to look deeper inside themselves to hopefully find an inner drive, passion and ability to move us with images.
Namaste'

c

[zganie]

Hey I am not upset neither am I against learning or giving/getting information
just lets not get stuck in a rutt here people
And as far as whats popular Best places to look are 1) magazines 2) any store or billboards 3)any other kind of advetising and I am sure I missed some.
thats whats going on not what someone else says

[jagerman]

No worries my friend!!!

I recently have been in a rut myself. I started out doing portraits ten years ago and moved into fashion a few years ago. It is always the same stuff time after time for me. I have never worked in an studio where I have not been top dog. I have never really had anyone to learn from. I am always the teacher. I see so many cool images on a daily basis and I am still doing the same old thing.

-W

[Sweetlight]

Jagerman,

Sounds like you have been at it a while and a little burned out, we all feel the heat at times. I started in 1989, before digital shooting high-end ad work and fashion. I have felt the burn several times but it's the love of the moment that brings us back. That frozen fragment of time that will forever exist. Our memories of where we have been, who we have met, and hopefully how we have influenced people in a positive way and given back as much as we have been given. Luckily I have always found a path for myself and busted my tail to make it work to the point that I can pretty much pick and choose my clients now and can also devote as much time doing charity work as I can. The money is nice but the maturity has shown me that the helping for me is a great reward. Don't let it get you down brother. Get out of the grind for a while. Go shoot something crazy, something you would never even dream of. Once when I got down I bought myself one of the cool, new, hip Holgas, you know the funky colored ones not the plain old black ones like the old Dianas. Ended up shooting a series of edgy stuff for one of the stiffest clients in the world. She knew she loved the work but not why. If she had known they were shot on a $20.00 toy camera with a plastic lens that I had sanded the outer edges down with steel wool??? She would have hated it. Fickle as art directors, haha. Peace to you. You will find your way, no worries.

c

[smak]

I think the people who want to learn Dave Hill style are not sending off these images to "Art Directors". They just want to learn the style.
Besides, many people here are "hobbyists" or have the job they like and probably are not planning to work at Vogue or Glamour. They just enjoy taking photos and working on them.

[Sweetlight]

Is it just me or am I just not saying what I mean?

I am sorry that this is my 4th post on this topic but every one of the posts before this one and including this one were intended to defend those people who keep requesting the "Dave Hill Experience". Every one was in rebuttal to those few people who always seem to take offense to people who ask for the "same old thing" or may come across as wanting something for nothing or any of the other multitude of what they consider infractions of some secret set of rules that maybe I have not been made privy to. From day one I have enjoyed this site because of the huge range of life and work experience from the very little to those that have been blessed with extreme talent and good fortune. A while back I made a comment to one of those that had a problem with this question because they seemed to think that someone was asking for free help and therefore he might be losing business. I spoke to the person requesting the help and found that that was not the intention at all but even if it was that is why we all are here and we all have free will. I myself choose to help as much as possible time allowing and have done so knowing that my reward would not be the pay but the fact as in one situation that I would restore a photo of a child who had passed away at a very young age. The mother was beside herself and I did what I could. After I had finished she offered compensation but I passed knowing that it would come back in spades just like work always does. Many times we pass on jobs that we are too busy for or for whatever reason don't want to work on to someone else, most times someone trying to get a foot in the door, work hard and become a part of the rest of the talented and experienced artists we see here every day. I don't think there are too many of us that without that first break may not have made it so in my mind karma dictates paying it forward. Then I was scolded in private message by coincidence the same guy who always gripes about me offering a huge amount of advice to a young shooter who was having a fit lighting a watch for a client. I chose to help, I don't think he took advantage, I am pretty worldly about being conned but even if I was, who cares. I learned something; shared some advice and I would do it for anyone who asked to the point that I found it true that I was being taken advantage of. An instructor of mine once told me " there will always be too many people trying to be artists/photographers/writers. No matter what the cream rises and there is always work for those who work hard." His name was Bob Lerner one of the first shooters for Look magazine and a wise man. He was right. There is work for everyone who works hard, with high ethics and a little grace every now and then helps a bit too. I have said enough, way too much I am sure but I want it clear that I am in favor of helping anyone who needs it and that was my intent from the start.
Namaste'

c