Not getting any work, should I lower rate?

[dvool]

Hey ya'll.

I've made a profile on modelmayhem.com and have been on the website for about 3 weeks now. I decided to charge $20/hr, but I haven't gotten any response/work.

I think my portfolio is pretty solid.
http://www.modelmayhem.com/member.php?id=727438

Since I am not getting any work, should I lower my asking price? $15/hr?

Or maybe come up with a price based on the level of work per image?
Like $10 dollars for basic retouch.
$20 dollars for advanced or something?

I feel more comfortable with an hourly rate though, especially since working on fine details of skin or what-not can take many hours.


Sorry for asking a question about rates, I think this is asked a lot. I just wanted some opinions. I thought $20/hr was reasonable.

[MatthewMarshall]

More samples on your portfolio may help. I would try to find some image that have major problems, like tons of zits. then have before and afters on your page

[Swampy]

dVool,

Your $20 rate in a market like California seems very low. I'm in the Swamps of Florida and I get $40 per hour. I don't know, but if I were a prospective customer, I'd wonder why your prices were so cheap.

My second thought is.. did you just put up a web page and expect the world to come running to your door? What other marketing and promotion are you doing?

[TommyO]

Devin,
- Your rate is fine, maybe too low.
- Your website will not attract customers without further advertising. I'm sure you are advertising. But, you must advertise alot. You will only get 1 out of every 100 potential clients.
- Your website "about me" does not tell us about "you"... only your rates. Add something about your experience, clients, depth of styles your work with, etc.
- Don't tell us how long things take. Just tell us what you can do. We know how long it takes and we know you're going to charge for your time. That's Ok.
- Take out the phrase "I am here to find work". Not professional, and sounds desparate. This may be why you're there, but a customer wants to hear about why you can meet their requirements.
- And yes, add more before & afters. Label them. Sometimes, we cannot tell what is before or after.... especially when they are of different sizes.

Hopefully you'll find this helpful. Good luck ! It's very competitive out there, so hang in there !

[Jerryb]

hi,
first i not a professional but maybe my thoughts will be helpful also in some respects my answer will be similar...

1. on the webpage itself.... I noticed there no meta keywords!! when people go searching on the internet for a retoucher..... those keywords are important... other wise other retouchers are going to be listed before yours!! remember on the internet there a lot of retouch outfits your competing with when a search is done...!!

this is a example of meta keywords that are hidden in a webpage ....
meta name="keywords" content="Photo Retouching, Retouching Photos, Photo Retouching Services, Image Retouching, Retouch Photos, Photo Retouch Service, Photos Retouching, Photo Retouching, Retouching Photos, Photo Retouching Services, Image Retouching, Retouch Photos, Photo Retouch Service, Photos Retouching"

2. you might want to take a look at some other retouching sites to give you ideas for your webpage and how they handle pricing..... i was not impressed with that phrase "i am here looking for work..." i would have left that out!!

3. and like mathewmarshell mentioned....... you showing off your work.... you want to make a impression.... hence select pictures that will give oooooh's and ahhhh's!!! remember your average consumer generally don't know how much a picture can be improved..... at least that my opinion... , and showing that, they'll remember you!! and based the quality of your work on the amount of improvement..!

4 and Like swampy mentioned... is webpage your only advertising? you got to let people know your around.... i would suggest...
a. use flyers in those shopping centers, you have bunch of them in orange county.. smiling....
b. give out cards and flyers at your local photography shops, photo developing stores, pc shops, etc

5. as far as pricing... I don't know..... others can give you a better idea...
orange county is rich county....!! I wouldn't thhink your prices are high!

those are my thought

Originally Posted by dvool

Hey ya'll.

I've made a profile on modelmayhem.com and have been on the website for about 3 weeks now. I decided to charge $20/hr, but I haven't gotten any response/work.

I think my portfolio is pretty solid.
http://www.modelmayhem.com/member.php?id=727438

Since I am not getting any work, should I lower my asking price? $15/hr?

Or maybe come up with a price based on the level of work per image?
Like $10 dollars for basic retouch.
$20 dollars for advanced or something?

I feel more comfortable with an hourly rate though, especially since working on fine details of skin or what-not can take many hours.


Sorry for asking a question about rates, I think this is asked a lot. I just wanted some opinions. I thought $20/hr was reasonable.

[mayday]

I think you should practice your technique a little more and build a larger portfolio of quality work before trying for paid work.
The better you get the more chance you have of getting good quality clients.

[Dave.Cox]

Good comments. You can't advertise too much.

I wouldn't worry about the metatags though. Current search engines don't really use them. Put your keywords in the text of your page.

[DiamondsDr47]

Where those prices coming from 20-15-10? Is your time worth any of it, or much more
then it? Also being the cheapest most likely bring you nowhere.... Practice, maybe find somebody do it for free, something worthwhile from stock library, build your web portfolio with strong images, while doing it buy some book or ask people in the trade on business practices, promote yourself. Draw attention with your work not the price. Some who will be interested will ask for the price(have your phone number on web)...You 'll find your niche!
Best regards,
Edgar

[dvool]

Hey everyone.

First of all, thanks for all the responses and advice.

I've seen people online charging anywhere from 100/hr to 10/hr. For most jr. positions, people normally pay around 20/hr and I have no previous retouching paid work experience, so I went with 20/hr.

Right now I have a part-time, non-art-related job and I get paid less than 10/hr. It's just a "job" while I work on my portfolio and find a real career.

I've always had a passion for art, especially drawing portraits of people. I've been learning 3D Computer Animation for the past couple of years and I've recently found that I really enjoy photo retouching and that I am good at it. So right now I am just building my portfolio in 3D & retouching, putting myself out there while working at my part-time job.

20/hr for something I enjoy doing sounded like a good start since I have no working experience in the art field yet. Someone suggested that I charge by what I can do with the photo per photo, I think I will probably go that route as I can see that a potential customer would like to know a more solid price per photo.


Modelmayhem is a business networking website. It is kind of like myspace, but for making business contacts. I put the line "I am here to find work" because when you create your profile, it suggests some things to mention and one of the things was "Why are you here?" lol - I can see how that line is both unneccessary and possibly a hinderance now. I'm going to remove it.

I have my actual website up
http://devindeleon.freehostia.com/
and it is a link on my modelmayhem profile, but I haven't put keywords or meta-tags or submitted it for search engines yet because I wanted to add a poster I did for a movie poster contest. The rules say I can't put it up on any websites until the judging for the contest is over. It's going to end any week now and then I plan on getting my website up and running. I also am waiting to see if I can get permission to use before & after from the on-set photography they provided.

Here is the movie poster in case anyone was curious.
http://edcommunity.apple.com/settosc...php?itemID=295


I seem to have posted my whole life's story... lol but people seem to be unsure as to where I was at.


Thanks again for all the advice. I really appreciate it. This forum is very helpful. I've really learned a lot.

[Swampy]

DVool... I suggest you get out from behind your computer and meet people face to face. Do you have business cards? Put your part time hours to use. The only thing you have to sell that the rest of the world's retouchers don't is your SELF. Go meet the people who can give you free lance work (anybody who deals with photography) they are your customers, not other retouchers in some nether world of an online network. Join the Chamber of Commerce and put your cards out here. Go to their mixers and luncheons and meet real people. I've gotten work just by walking into my bank where the folks there know what I do and tell me to "call this friend of mine, she was looking for someone to...."

[NCP Doug]

dvool

I agree with the other great comments, just wanted to comment on the roll-over's on you website.

Most roll-over examples I have encountered have shown the original picture first THEN the retouched example.

[zganie]

Hi Dvool,you need a marketing plan,not just a website and the plan should be for at least 12months.Theres lots of info on the net how to do this,so I dont need to tell you

Plus Cheap rates dont equal getting jobs

[synthetamine]

Originally Posted by Jerryb

on the webpage itself.... I noticed there no meta keywords!! when people go searching on the internet for a retoucher..... those keywords are important...

disregard that, no search engines still use meta keywords.

[digitalcanvas73]

Originally Posted by dvool

Hey ya'll.

I've made a profile on modelmayhem.com and have been on the website for about 3 weeks now. I decided to charge $20/hr, but I haven't gotten any response/work.

I think my portfolio is pretty solid.
http://www.modelmayhem.com/member.php?id=727438

Since I am not getting any work, should I lower my asking price? $15/hr?

Or maybe come up with a price based on the level of work per image?
Like $10 dollars for basic retouch.
$20 dollars for advanced or something?

I feel more comfortable with an hourly rate though, especially since working on fine details of skin or what-not can take many hours.


Sorry for asking a question about rates, I think this is asked a lot. I just wanted some opinions. I thought $20/hr was reasonable.

First of all you joined the wrong website to find work. I am also have a profile on Model Mayhem (MM#354907). Don't expect paid work from that website. People expect everything for free there.
You should show your portfolio to local fashion photographers who have regular clients. They will be glad to have you as their re-touching artist.
Don't lower your rate.

[Swampy]

I agree with digtalcanvas. Don't lower your price. You start to look desperate. You're in the LA area for Pete's sake. Get out on the street and pay sales calls on the photographers and model studios. Take some kind of specialty item to leave behind with your name and phone number on it (coffee cup, lense cleaner pack, letter opener etc.) Your work is very good, but you've got to make sure that your potential clients SEE it and REMEMBER YOU. So get out and introduce yourself.

[dvool]

Thanks digtalcanvas, thanks swampy, for the advice.

Yah, I think approaching photographers or studios is the way to go.

[MrAlexajlex]

I agree with what was posted as far as getting a photo has serious issues and retouching it.

Talking about before shots that have heavy warm/orange color casts.

Check these B/As:

http://www.retouchpro.com/gallery/sh...ser/15940/sl/b

http://www.retouchpro.com/gallery/sh...ser/15940/sl/b

Do some like the links I posted and it will show a drastic change to the better.
The change has to be drastic to hit people in the face (granted some are familiar with retouching and can spot the subtle differences but most are not).

[Sweetlight]

I think most of the folks hit the nail on the head. I am no retoucher but I have been shooting ad work for a very long time. When I first started out I was only 19 and pounding down the doors of clients that had been using photographers with years and years of experience.
I think I did as most people would do in my situation or with any job situation and I lowered my day rate to try and lowball the more experienced shooters. There is no way to say this without sounding boastful but I am not trying to be at all. I was a damn good shooter right out of school and instead of trying to get jobs with smaller clients I went right for the big boys but kept getting shot down but at the same time being told how good my portfolio was. One day I sat down with the execs and art directors of a little company you may have heard of called Tropicana. I had literally swamped them with promo pieces, resumes, references and phone calls, enough that they finally played a little bit of attention to me for no reason other than to get me to shut the hell up I am sure. My book was loved by all of the ad execs and art directors but once again I was shot down. That night the head art director called me at home and gave me the best advice anyone has ever given me in reference to my business. He said, "Chris, everyone is blown away by your work but you are under bidding, double your day rate." From that point on I doubled my day rate sometimes even more depending on the market I would be shooting in. As I matured I began to understand that people will give you excellent pay for excellent work. Underbidding tends to give some people the idea that you have no confidence in your abilities, so why should they. As I started mingling my ad work with the sale of fine art prints I found the same situation. It's a fine line between too much and too little but you can always come down on a price, especially if you are standing there as a customer is eyeballing a piece of your work. "Mam, I see you like that piece, it's been hanging here a while without much of anyone showing interest. If you would like it I'll go ahead and knock a hundred off for you 'cause between you and me I need the extra wall space for some new pieces. I swear, it works almost every time. People who buy are especially feel that if it's a bit expensive it must be REALLY GOOD and this guy must be REALLY GOOD to put that price on his work. I love my customers, especially those that buy my fine art photos or my fish paintings. It has always been hard for me to let my work go, like I am giving up my child for adoption. I always get personal info on the customer and send them a thank you card and usually a bottle of wine. I guess that long winded, run on sentence just means, DOUBLE YOUR RATE, you may be surprised.

c

[Swampy]

Excellent advice, Chris!

[DiamondsDr47]

Excellent advice, actually i did kind of the same thing...
Best regards,

[HughSteenk]

Get better

[glamourmakeover]

Originally Posted by TommyO

Devin,
- Your rate is fine, maybe too low.
- Your website will not attract customers without further advertising. I'm sure you are advertising. But, you must advertise alot. You will only get 1 out of every 100 potential clients.
- Your website "about me" does not tell us about "you"... only your rates. Add something about your experience, clients, depth of styles your work with, etc.
- Don't tell us how long things take. Just tell us what you can do. We know how long it takes and we know you're going to charge for your time. That's Ok.
- Take out the phrase "I am here to find work". Not professional, and sounds desparate. This may be why you're there, but a customer wants to hear about why you can meet their requirements.
- And yes, add more before & afters. Label them. Sometimes, we cannot tell what is before or after.... especially when they are of different sizes.

Hopefully you'll find this helpful. Good luck ! It's very competitive out there, so hang in there !

Good advice