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The French are messing with us

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  #21  
Old 03-12-2009, 10:22 AM
zacker zacker is offline
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Re: The French are messing with us

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Originally Posted by Markzebra View Post
Yeah there's a certain amount of guilt associated with me making that comment I can assure you. It wasnt meant that way though, I promise. Guess I did make it though
Oh believe me, her voice was making me involuntarily clear my throat.
I HATE that!
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  #22  
Old 03-12-2009, 03:37 PM
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MaximMorin MaximMorin is offline
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Re: The French are messing with us

Quantum3Studio:

I totally agree with you on much of your point (even if i'm not such a fan of the freud theories, thoses about the pulsion of life and death applied well to the advertising world), espacially when so well explain. but still, we can offer and illusion world without body modification i think. I understand thought that the goal must be almost impossible to reach, because, if so, they will stop consuming products...
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  #23  
Old 03-12-2009, 07:57 PM
Quantum3Studio Quantum3Studio is offline
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Lightbulb Re: The French are messing with us

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Originally Posted by MaximMorin View Post
Quantum3Studio:

I totally agree with you on much of your point (even if i'm not such a fan of the freud theories, thoses about the pulsion of life and death applied well to the advertising world), espacially when so well explain. but still, we can offer and illusion world without body modification i think. I understand thought that the goal must be almost impossible to reach, because, if so, they will stop consuming products...
That's right, mate. And consumption is like a wheel of fortunes and misfortunes that never stops spinning or capitaslism will collapse. Just see what's happing in these days, "Capitalism will collapse!!!!" says the newspaper... It's just part of the life's natural wavelenghts, however, this partocular topic, which is concuption, is managed by Banks, Enterprises and Governments, in that order (Governments are just the mediator between people and The Bank. You would say Government takes care about other things, but money is what really cares). So, Banks give loans, so, for each loan you have to pay some interest to the bank (3% per american dollar), that interest is multiplied for another interest that makes that each year, the interest is more and more expensive.
For example, you rent a home and the lanlord tells you that the first year, you have to pay $2300 per month, next year you have to pay $2760 and the next one you have to pay $3312 Well, 2300*1.2%=2760*1.2%=3312 and so on. Same happens with loans, and money come from loans that Government asks to the some Bank I cannot remember now which bank is. Anyway, Enterprises also rules the goverments, Banks are the money of the governments and all this events are managed by the people who manages that bank I cannot remember its name. Yeah, it's well said that: "the more money, the more jobs", but also, more inflation, the bigger the interest that keeps growing and growing and countries keep taking loans and the snowball gets bigger and bigger and bigger = collapse. There are too much dollars! The value of each usd goes down because the abundance of these, so a collapse is applyed in order to generate a Financial Crisis, cut abundance and raise the value of each dollar again. And don't forget the interest per each american dollar that goes up and up every year!!! That means that for each 10,000,000.00 of dollars the government asks, there are 300,000.00 of interest, the next year the owe will be 90,000,000.00 and the third year will be 270,000,000.00 of debt, which also means, more money but never enogh in order to pay those damn 300,000.00 usd from the begining. Same happens with sea currents, otherwise, the sea will become stagnant and all the sea life dies. Well, some banks use to blocks that money currents in order to suffocate certain group of countries and then, buying it for some cents. You see what's happening with the homes in Miami. They are sold at ridiculous prices!!! Devaluation and Crisis are very well studied and premeditated. I believe the same real states buy its own houses. It's like having a retail shop, burning all inside and then, getting the money from the insurance. Scam, in one word. And that's how the money flows. Consumers are just a little part of all this chain of events.

Have to go to consume pizza...!

Have a nice day!

Mart
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  #24  
Old 03-15-2009, 11:40 PM
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Little Fisher Little Fisher is offline
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Re: The French are messing with us

I liked the last thought in that video...

"If a magazine isn't going to disclose the extent to which an image was retouched, then at least put the retoucher's name in the credits"
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  #25  
Old 03-16-2009, 01:42 AM
Quantum3Studio Quantum3Studio is offline
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Smile Re: The French are messing with us

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Originally Posted by Little Fisher View Post
I liked the last thought in that video...

"If a magazine isn't going to disclose the extent to which an image was retouched, then at least put the retoucher's name in the credits"
Oh, I haven't heard that part... That sounds superb!!! In fact, and nowadays, pictures without our retouch wouldn't look so nice. Of course, Photographers can do excellent jobs with the make-up, etc. In fact, I preffer the fashion photos before the digital era. They were more appealing and artistic instead shocking. There is a big difference between "shocking" and "artistic", and those are the Special Effects we put on the pics. Another point to keep in mind is that the people gives all the credit to the photographer like "Wow, what an amazing photo!!! Look those lights, those colors!!!", but all that stuff is made in Photoshop. We know that even the best photographer retouchs its pics in order to make them look great. Unless, of course, the photographer like the old fashioned way, which is impossible in practice, due the standards.
It's the same like a music group. People get amazed about how cool sounds any music group, but nobody thinks that, thanks to the sound enginnering, the group sounds that good.
We do the final output, in few words. Just like the sound enginnering.

Mart
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  #26  
Old 03-16-2009, 08:15 AM
vapman vapman is offline
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Re: The French are messing with us

I think it would be great for retouchers to be disclosed. Photographers get all the credit, true, and i dont mind with that, but if people are aware of the existance of a retoucher and the vital importance of his role, his leverage also increases.
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  #27  
Old 03-16-2009, 09:45 AM
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LQQKER LQQKER is offline
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Re: The French are messing with us

Simple . . . Every human image that we see should have a disclaimer (like a cigarette pack). This should also include every woman that wears make-up, a bra, girdle, wig, colored contacts, etc. By law, they should mandatorily wear dog tags (no pun intended) with their true body image and face.

For example:
"Caution: This human image is retouched or altered to some degree and not in accordance to facts"

"Warning, it is impossible to ever look like this, unless you're a mannequin"

I mean REALLY . . . Did you ever see a mug shot of a movie/TV personality that was being charged with a DUI??

We seem to be a society that is so easily deceived or cheated pertaining to reality. After all, we must all wear deodorant (because we don't smell like we should). Go figure . . .

Bottom line: Vanity is part of the human condition and are we really interested in being shown or told the truth? Of course we bitch about it. . . but you have to keep in mind the percentage that buy into this, subconsciously knowing (hopefully) it's BS.

My next topic will cover "why obese women wear spandex" stay tuned . . . .
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  #28  
Old 03-16-2009, 09:51 AM
Quantum3Studio Quantum3Studio is offline
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Re: The French are messing with us

"Caution: This human image is retouched or altered to some degree and not in accordance to facts" JAjajJAjJA This is freaking funny! I really like it!!! JEjeje... It can be a nice add by the way!!! =D
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  #29  
Old 03-16-2009, 10:10 AM
vapman vapman is offline
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Re: The French are messing with us

I believe its mainly a matter of non-awareness of a retoucher in the image producing process (to the mainstream that is).
Retouching is still relatively a new thing. Even alot of photographers i introduce myself to get amazed on what can really be done when i show them some of my befores and afters, and direct them to some retoucher's site's before's and afters of their own, so they can further get the picture on how the game is being played nowadays.
"Oh, so this retouched to this extent? i actually thought the photographer was just really absolutely amazing after all, had better lighting and technique than me, only picked super models, never really could imagine his photos without DI would be so like mine"
I swear this is true. Photographers in the business of ad photography still getting surprised at the extent of manipulations. They were taught to shoot traditionally, not with this new filter gimmicks we use, so as consequence they tend to think traditionally as well.
My point is, if you can even find photographers who are not completely aware of the extend of things, imagine the general public. Maybe 20 years from now we may look at people who still believe all they see in mags is natural the same way we look at people who believe WF matches are for real, but not now. Its all still a novelty.
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  #30  
Old 03-16-2009, 12:00 PM
Quantum3Studio Quantum3Studio is offline
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Thumbs up Re: The French are messing with us

Quote:
Originally Posted by vapman View Post
I believe its mainly a matter of non-awareness of a retoucher in the image producing process (to the mainstream that is).
Retouching is still relatively a new thing. Even alot of photographers i introduce myself to get amazed on what can really be done when i show them some of my befores and afters, and direct them to some retoucher's site's before's and afters of their own, so they can further get the picture on how the game is being played nowadays.
"Oh, so this retouched to this extent? i actually thought the photographer was just really absolutely amazing after all, had better lighting and technique than me, only picked super models, never really could imagine his photos without DI would be so like mine"
I swear this is true. Photographers in the business of ad photography still getting surprised at the extent of manipulations. They were taught to shoot traditionally, not with this new filter gimmicks we use, so as consequence they tend to think traditionally as well.
My point is, if you can even find photographers who are not completely aware of the extend of things, imagine the general public. Maybe 20 years from now we may look at people who still believe all they see in mags is natural the same way we look at people who believe WF matches are for real, but not now. Its all still a novelty.
Never so perfectly stated, pal. Great coment on this great topic It says all. But from Renaissance, painters used to "retouch" their paints. They used to reduce the age and omitting to paint some skin deffects, in the earlier years of photography, some photographers (or with some painters) used to add some beauty to the portraits as well. Of course, not the huge manipulation we can see nowadays, but retouching always was there. And of course, not all people knows about Renaissance. However, this topic always have been a secret.

I like what you have written here: "Oh, so this retouched to this extent? i actually thought the photographer was just really absolutely amazing after all, had better lighting and technique than me, only picked super models, never really could imagine his photos without DI would be so like mine". Plus, all your comment. I also thought the same till I started doing retouching. There are not super models, well, not the amount that we see in magazines. In fact, have you realized that some models have strange faces in the magazines? I'm absolutely sure those where digitally made. I mean, starting with a real subject, but changing at least, the 70% of the shapes, in order to create a totally different face. Just check what I have done here, it's not an extreme retouch, but it shows part of what I meant

My First Attempt

My second Attemp

Make sure to click on the loupe, located in the right upper corner

Mart
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