How to Sell Skin Pore Retouch Textures - Ideas

[ray12]

I have developed a retouching capability where you can artistically add photographic quality and anatomically correct skin pores back into a picture.

The technology works with Adobe Photoshop CS2-CS5 PC or MAC

It is good for covering over and hiding cloning work you do on a face, or replacing skin texture on a cheek or thigh or forehead because you have smoothed in that area, or there is no texture to begin with, or you want to have an area of blemishes or dry patchy skin look magazine picture perfect.

How would I go about proposing that Adobe, or Nik, or Portrait Professional kind of companies take a look at it for development by them into their own product line. I can sell the skin pores myself individually but im not necessarily gifted in this area...im an artist retoucher.

Ive been to several initial consulting sessions with lawyers and they have given me some ideas that vary in opinion even. So im still working on that.

Any stray bits and pieces of ideas for me?

Here is a video link showing the skin pore technology and how it is used.

http://www.screencast.com/t/oVQkQvB3MaZ

I have used the potential product I developed almost every day and it is invaluable for having picture perfect retouches...but how do I turn it from an in-house tool...to something for the retoucher whi needs something like this?

Cheers

Thanks

[Xaran]

That looks absolutely brilliant - I would suggest that getting in touch with Portrait Professional might be an idea - or one of the 3D modelling sites such as Renderosity.

Please post back here if you do set up an outlet I would certainly be interested but could depend on the price.

Christine

[ray12]

Hi Christine,

Thanks for the encouragement and the suggestions.

I hadnt thought of Renderosity. Eventually the skin pores could be used on 3d models I suppose. I have skin pore textures from each major part of the body as seamlessly tiled sheets of any size at web and print resolution. There are approx 16 different kinds of skin textures on the human body and each has a different characteristic pattern. Im not sure what I would have to provide to a 3D modeler...would seamless sheets be adequate? Or are there some other special ways that textures are used and provided in modeling?

With Portrait Professional I could provide skin pore "masks" that would register right over the face as you adjust the eyes and lips...you could also be stretching the texture mask at the same time... and registering the pores in the correct places (the eye pores are especially sensitive to positioning under the eyes).

I wonder how I could successfully get the attention of a larger company like that. Ive tried e-mails but they sometimes go unanswered it seems...people are busy.

Thanks again for your suggestion...very helpful.

[Xaran]

Ray,

The 3D people who create textures for the various models would probably use PSD files. I am assuming that your process is a texture layer and mask.

Getting really good textures for 3D models can be a real headache - usually they look like plastic dolls.

Another company that may be interested is Akvis they do some excellent plug-ins. Their support is pretty good so you could try emailing support @akvis.com. The only name I have there is Irina Vesnina. They also have a support forum here.

Hope you get this going. If I can be of any help send me a PM.

Christine

[ashphotoart]

Originally Posted by ray12

I have developed a retouching capability where you can artistically add photographic quality and anatomically correct skin pores back into a picture.

The technology works with Adobe Photoshop CS2-CS5 PC or MAC

It is good for covering over and hiding cloning work you do on a face, or replacing skin texture on a cheek or thigh or forehead because you have smoothed in that area, or there is no texture to begin with, or you want to have an area of blemishes or dry patchy skin look magazine picture perfect.

How would I go about proposing that Adobe, or Nik, or Portrait Professional kind of companies take a look at it for development by them into their own product line. I can sell the skin pores myself individually but im not necessarily gifted in this area...im an artist retoucher.

Ive been to several initial consulting sessions with lawyers and they have given me some ideas that vary in opinion even. So im still working on that.

Any stray bits and pieces of ideas for me?

Here is a video link showing the skin pore technology and how it is used.

http://www.screencast.com/t/oVQkQvB3MaZ

I have used the potential product I developed almost every day and it is invaluable for having picture perfect retouches...but how do I turn it from an in-house tool...to something for the retoucher whi needs something like this?

Cheers

Thanks

Ray,

I can simply advice you to develop a scritpting plugin to use ur texture into play, so low end professionals also able to use it without having good knowledge about pores and textures and you can make a good market for your product. for it I think u need to do it :-
1. Create a script where photoshop user can select the pores and apply it in masking mode to a layer.
2. after applying properly it will merge into a layer so your secrets are hidden.
3. contact a software developer so he can make a software for it, be sure there must be functionlity to use as a demo and after puchase license methods.

at first it is a bit hard but if you really dig into business think about it. I can give u more info if you need. e-mail me.

[twopoint0]

Ray- I watched most of the video yesterday, and I'm still thinking about it. You definitely have something there.
I didn't see if you built some kind of plug in around them, but I'd love to just have the texture files to brush apply through layers.
My advice? Move fast on this.

[ashphotoart]

Unfortunately I'm not able to see the videos. getting error on the page.

[ray12]

The original link has moved to:

http://www.screencast.com/t/wIHk5WI0yyIG

I will leave it up for a few more days. Perhaps till March 15 2011. The bandwidth requirements are quite large. I will look possibly into producing a smaller size clip.

Please note that this video is on a retouch image of a rock performer singing on stage... so the colors are a bit theatrical by nature.

[ray12]

Hi Ash,

I think you are correct. I did try to get 2 software developers to work on it...but they were so intent on running up billing hours and high development costs that it left me cold...after it was done they were not able to provide a workable solution as you suggest in a reasonable time and at a reasonable cost. I may need to get someone locally to me so I can collaborate with them closely.

[Repairman]

Good vid Ray. Are the textures scaleable to accommodate all file sizes/resolutions (within typical commercial requirements)? Do you have variations of texture for different skin types - child/adult, asian/african etc?
R.

[ray12]

Hi Repairman,

Yes the skin pore textures are individual types of textures and can be dynamically created to meet commercial requirements from amateur web size 800pix 72 dpi images... up to professional 300dpi 16" x 20" print ad images. They are applied and controlled by an add and subtract brush and follow the flow characteristics of an airbrush.

There are over 20 different kinds of specific pore textures we have created. Our newest version can produce an almost unlimited size and scale of pores and is totally seamless.

The pores can be corrected in color, and in transparency, and in blending, and depth and lighting direction. They are easy and quick to apply and look well under close scrutiny. It is possible to exactly match and produce the proper yellow or brown or gray pore colors for different ethnic groups. Both children and adults have the same kind of skin pores...but are applied and manifested a bit differently. The application is quite variable to be able to accommodate both.

The reason im posting this here in the business section is that I can sell these myself obviously, but it seems to me that they might quite valuable to a wide media population. Some associates are encouraging me to make them available for free...others say im nuts for not recovering my development costs and for generating a revenue stream because they are highly unique and quite valuable to the end users. Id be more comfortable licensing them to an Adobe, or Portrait Professional or Nik if I could recoup my development efforts and also create a revenue stream for myself for sharing my highly developed image resource library and the processes of creation and the learnings of professional end user application.

Id love to find a business associate who could help me figure out how to work through this issue well. I might have a product that could be highly useful to many photographers, studios, retouchers and 3D media producers.

[wimver]

Ray,

3D people also need a bump map or displacement map, rather than an imagemap, except for the face, where there is variation in color toning as well as pores/grooves.
the rest of the body has rather monotone tints, thus a displacement map will do there in most cases (ellbows and knees are another exception).
a bump or displacement map is not the same as a greyscale version of the tone map.
white parts are high, black parts are deep.

cheers
wim

[ray12]

Hi Wim,

How would I go about testing if I can convert my skin textures into displacement maps...is there something special or are there programs that can convert. While I have elements of white, gray and black in my textures...what could I do to convert them into texture bump maps?

Can I do it in Photoshops displacement map function...or is there a process that 3D people use to convert grayscale information into proper displacement maps?

Thanks

[wimver]

Ray,
sometimes it works to just use the grayscale images, but it all depends on the nature of the texture and how the texture is lighted. if the shadows are too harsh then you get unrealistic results, the relief does not resemble the real texture.
imagine that with a bump map, the deep grooves of the skin are black, and the "goose bump tips" are white. with a regular image, one side of the grooves is lighter than the other, and the goose bumps are equally lit, which places them at the same depth level as the grooves, but reversed (e.g. white left, black right for goose bumps, and the other way round for the grooves). this is what makes it unreal if you use this in 3D.

I haven't tried with skin, I am more into technical 3D, but you can google for leather bump map or displacement map, and analyse these, and see if your patterns come close. although there is a lot of not so good material out there, so beware.

I also forgot to mention a third method used in 3d, namely normal mapping. this is done by illuminating the object with 4 different colors of light, and gives the most spectacular type of relief simulation. but I am not shure if they use this for skins too. those cannot be derived from a grayscale image.

after next weekend (march 20) I have some more time and then I can do some tests with plain skin texture like the one you use, applied to a 3D object and see what the effect is.
I will post the results here or can email them to you if you like.

cheers
wim

[ray12]

Hi Wim,

Yes, That would be very kind of you. You can send me a personal message here at RetouchPro and we can trade e-mails. Thank you for the displacement map and texture map explanation. I have a very nice spread and separation in my library images and the textures are very precisely lit.

Can I make some geometric displacement maps in Photoshop CS5 Extended using my 2d textures somehow? I might be able to handle that.

I have an older version of DAZ Studio and some victoria models...ive never learned to run the program yet...could I use that to create some displacement maps from my nicely lit and graded 2D PSD or Tif files?

[pixeljar]

I did a little experiment with extracting snake skin texture
and applying it on a model's face. I would like to try doing it with an elephant as well. Good luck!!

[ray12]

Hi pixeljar, I did that too!! I can remember the day! Most girls dont like snakes...so it didnt go over too well with most of the models. How funny! Thanks for chiming in