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  • Skin

    I'm having a problem with skin toning and making skin look very smooth like in these pictures. What is the techniques to accomplish what is shown in both of these pictures. Is one using dodge and burn?
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  • #2
    Re: Skin

    Unless your objective is to over blur and/or ignore natural lighting I wouldn't strive to emulate these images in any way. Just Google images of skin retouching and it will yield far better results for you to reference and youtube, of course, has loads of tutorials.

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    • #3
      Re: Skin

      don't know why you like this skin retouch....try Portraiture by Imagenomic if you don't have time for D&B.

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      • #4
        Re: Skin

        Thank you, I seem to get splotchy results when I'm doing skin. I'm thinking I have to really study dodge and burn, which I do need a good tutorials. I've watched many on youtube but it's just not coming out the way I want them.

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: Skin

          Originally posted by ab Martin View Post
          I've watched many on youtube but it's just not coming out the way I want them.
          That's because most of them are terrible. I can tell you the most frequent mistakes seen on here in case any of them apply to your situation.

          People think too much in absolutes. For example they feel they need to use a soft brush, so they never alter brush hardness. Sometimes it would fix undesirable bleeding on other pixels, but it's just an example.

          They don't test where their cursor actually goes in an objective manner. There's some amount of precision to this stuff, and the best way you can get an idea of how much control you have is to try a few rough shapes or letters on a blank canvas. It will tell you how accurate you really are.

          They zoom in way too far. If you spend a lot of your time beyond 100%, you lose perspective for things. It doesn't make the work any better.

          They know nothing about the anatomical structures in the face, shoulders, arms, etc. This leads people to create strange and often stupid looking highlights that make little sense, or render something too flat in the final, giving a really fake look.

          I think you're most likely stuck with a combination of the last one and the accuracy issue by the way you describe it. If you think something is splotchy and you're just a bit off, you can just create new splotchiness. If you don't pay careful attention to various structures in the face and focus only on pores, you fall into the last trap.

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          • #6
            Re: Skin

            Dodge and burn is just a painting tool, like a crayon or a brush or spray or whatever. You need to understand the image.

            This is why there and will be only a handful of decent and even less good retouchers. Retouching is discipline, patience, decisiveness, great taste that you're willing to throw out the window if client so asks and the actual labour.

            Things are splotchy when they are not smooth. You're probably being to aggressive. Take your time on the image, but correct only what needs to be corrected. Don't go softening everything, there is no point in it.

            First one obviously way too soft, you painted over the model with a huge brush. Second one way too inconsistent. No highlights on the chest and necklace, face splotchy and obviously the shading isn't fitting her anatomy. Hair has WB off, highlights are to white making it look gray, where it meets the neck is obvoiusly badly masked and it's supposed to affect the lighting of the face, this way it looks pasted on.

            more_is_more.jpg Real messy but just so you understand that anything dark doesn't reflect as much light.
            Last edited by skoobey; 06-13-2015, 02:26 PM.

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            • #7
              Re: Skin

              Thank you, yes they are not very good and I've looked at so many my eyes crossed and after watching so many it's confusing. Use blur don't use blur, make a grey layer don't make a grey layer etc.

              That's one reason I joined here was to learn. The reason I chose these examples (I did not do them) was it was almost like doll skin and I figured I'd get some technique and help. So if you could point me to a good tutorial for skin and skin toning I'd sure appreciate it.

              Originally posted by klev View Post
              That's because most of them are terrible. I can tell you the most frequent mistakes seen on here in case any of them apply to your situation.

              People think too much in absolutes. For example they feel they need to use a soft brush, so they never alter brush hardness. Sometimes it would fix undesirable bleeding on other pixels, but it's just an example.

              They don't test where their cursor actually goes in an objective manner. There's some amount of precision to this stuff, and the best way you can get an idea of how much control you have is to try a few rough shapes or letters on a blank canvas. It will tell you how accurate you really are.

              They zoom in way too far. If you spend a lot of your time beyond 100%, you lose perspective for things. It doesn't make the work any better.

              They know nothing about the anatomical structures in the face, shoulders, arms, etc. This leads people to create strange and often stupid looking highlights that make little sense, or render something too flat in the final, giving a really fake look.

              I think you're most likely stuck with a combination of the last one and the accuracy issue by the way you describe it. If you think something is splotchy and you're just a bit off, you can just create new splotchiness. If you don't pay careful attention to various structures in the face and focus only on pores, you fall into the last trap.

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: Skin

                Hi Skoobey; I didn't do these, I just used them as an example. I'm trying to learn to be a good retoucher. I really love doing it so I was hoping I could learn from the greats on this forum. I wasn't sure if dodge and burn had a magical power as I always see people talking about using them.

                Thank you for the good advice.






                Originally posted by skoobey View Post
                Dodge and burn is just a painting tool, like a crayon or a brush or spray or whatever. You need to understand the image.

                This is why there and will be only a handful of decent and even less good retouchers. Retouching is discipline, patience, decisiveness, great taste that you're willing to throw out the window if client so asks and the actual labour.

                Things are splotchy when they are not smooth. You're probably being to aggressive. Take your time on the image, but correct only what needs to be corrected. Don't go softening everything, there is no point in it.

                First one obviously way too soft, you painted over the model with a huge brush. Second one way too inconsistent. No highlights on the chest and necklace, face splotchy and obviously the shading isn't fitting her anatomy. Hair has WB off, highlights are to white making it look gray, where it meets the neck is obvoiusly badly masked and it's supposed to affect the lighting of the face, this way it looks pasted on.

                [ATTACH]95175[/ATTACH] Real messy but just so you understand that anything dark doesn't reflect as much light.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: Skin

                  Originally posted by ab Martin View Post
                  So if you could point me to a good tutorial for skin and skin toning I'd sure appreciate it.
                  If I knew any really good ones, I would point you to them. I don't think that highly of subject specific ones in general. Even if they're done by someone very talented, you're likely to see more of a case study than anything, which may not be helpful in replicating it on your own work.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: Skin

                    Well, they are all good. Gry Garness is definitely good, Chris Tarantino is also good(you can see both of them here, in the rent videos section of the site), also Carrie Beene, Pratik Naik.

                    But more than anything it's looking at great images and making yours look like that. Retouching, both for still and motion is a manual process, there is no trick, you simply have to understand what you want.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: Skin

                      Hair is harder.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: Skin

                        Hair and pattern are the two things I didn't know about when I started doing this. If someone had told me that those are so difficult I might have dropped retouching.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: Skin

                          If you lose texture on the skin the images start to look like digital paintings more than actual photos. This is not a bad thing, I don't know what your target is.

                          There are several skin retouching techniques that can be used, depending on situation and target. If your requirements are to edit and keep realism, then this type of editing is not good.

                          First go on youtube and search "photoshop retouch skin", watch first 30-40 videos and you will get many tips. I say that many because many videos are bad tutorials. Don't believe 100% what they say, Just take notes and complete your knowledge, define your own editing style.

                          Then go on youtube and search "Photoshop Dodge & Burn". Well, you get an idea. In a few days you will master skin retouching!

                          Also a printed book by Scott Kelby would be very useful, google this guy.

                          Here is an example youtube tutorial with a many good tips:
                          https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3mGUK4QDeNE

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                          • #14
                            Re: Skin

                            Master skin retouching in few days? Maybe basic clean up. Noone became master painter in a few days. Years, sure.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Re: Skin

                              Originally posted by paulkris View Post
                              Then go on youtube and search "Photoshop Dodge & Burn". Well, you get an idea. In a few days you will master skin retouching!
                              I think this is a little misleading. First there are a lot of edge cases that come up even in something as fundamental as smoothing out skin. Second you don't just touch pores and blemishes. Any muscle and bone structure is described across the same surface, so maintaining that while smoothing undesirable elements all while staring at the screen for an extended period of time may take some real practice. I think that if you can learn to acknowledge some of these details early on, it's likely to shorten the learning curve. I still think it takes both practice and maturity of judgement. Anatomical mistakes should lessen with time, just like overdoing the smoothing part.

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